This is SNCF response to FRECCIAROSSA - Business Premiere from Paris to Lyon
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Date: 2024-01-09
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Comments and reviews: 35
-PeterFriedrich19
I think the Italian offering is a bit too much for me in terms of food.
But the SNCF answer is lacking.
I'm a simple, but good ingredients made well kind of chap. So I don't need fancy, but it better be good, it doesn't even have to be a full meal. (but on the full Paris-Milan stretch I could use that probably)
France has a lot of these little and simple food options. So I find it strange that they don't offer it on their flagship trains. Even heating it could go long ways. I don't know what's in the lower level on the bar coach, but I think they could've made room for a bigger kitchen/galley area.
Also the Gare du Lyon looks stunning but the gates, and long platforms without under/overpasses don't help the passenger flow unfortunately.
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I think the Italian offering is a bit too much for me in terms of food.
But the SNCF answer is lacking.
I'm a simple, but good ingredients made well kind of chap. So I don't need fancy, but it better be good, it doesn't even have to be a full meal. (but on the full Paris-Milan stretch I could use that probably)
France has a lot of these little and simple food options. So I find it strange that they don't offer it on their flagship trains. Even heating it could go long ways. I don't know what's in the lower level on the bar coach, but I think they could've made room for a bigger kitchen/galley area.
Also the Gare du Lyon looks stunning but the gates, and long platforms without under/overpasses don't help the passenger flow unfortunately.
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-MrEoinkeane
The one time I traveled with the TGV I traveled from Paris to Barcelona first class. I felt the TGV was a commuter train more than a luxury train. First class isn-t that expensive. I would honestly pay a better price for first class from Paris to Barcelona to be treated business class like this video since it-s such a stretch. Which is why I don-t get why they introduce it on this line. It-s -only- 2 hours. I can sit that one out easily. Loved the Paris to Lyon high speed but it was the part after that I could-ve really used some food and drinks to my table.
Amazing video, I-m going to consider this if they operate to Barcelona. But, with Renfe coming as well I will probably jump on that train next time I am going.
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The one time I traveled with the TGV I traveled from Paris to Barcelona first class. I felt the TGV was a commuter train more than a luxury train. First class isn-t that expensive. I would honestly pay a better price for first class from Paris to Barcelona to be treated business class like this video since it-s such a stretch. Which is why I don-t get why they introduce it on this line. It-s -only- 2 hours. I can sit that one out easily. Loved the Paris to Lyon high speed but it was the part after that I could-ve really used some food and drinks to my table.
Amazing video, I-m going to consider this if they operate to Barcelona. But, with Renfe coming as well I will probably jump on that train next time I am going.
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-BarryBynum
Thank you for all of the great train content and now doing verbal sound. I have taught English as a Second Language and have a couple of tips. Some people tend to read out loud faster then they would normally speak. You have admitted that your French accent is thick and that is true. If you slow down, your English would be better understood. I am not suggesting anything dramatic, but in some places you are reading so fast that your words slur into one long word. In places of the video where you are adlibbing the English is easier to understand. Please know this is not a complaint. I am just offering a little advice. The advice is free and of course that may be all it is worth. ---
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Thank you for all of the great train content and now doing verbal sound. I have taught English as a Second Language and have a couple of tips. Some people tend to read out loud faster then they would normally speak. You have admitted that your French accent is thick and that is true. If you slow down, your English would be better understood. I am not suggesting anything dramatic, but in some places you are reading so fast that your words slur into one long word. In places of the video where you are adlibbing the English is easier to understand. Please know this is not a complaint. I am just offering a little advice. The advice is free and of course that may be all it is worth. ---
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-Fan652w
Thank you Thibault for a very informative video! My experience of TGV Duplexes was back in 2009! I was most impressed! On the specific point of the food, I was astounded that there was nothing hot available. I am not a fussy person when it comes to food. But paying 149 Euros I would expect some hot food, even if it was only a Hanburger, and served on a proper plate!
Regarding presentation, I like your spoken commentary. It gives an extra 'personal' character to the video. But this native English-speaker does not understand what you meant by 'a boomer position. ' (The problem you had going through the gate at Gare de Lyon)
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Thank you Thibault for a very informative video! My experience of TGV Duplexes was back in 2009! I was most impressed! On the specific point of the food, I was astounded that there was nothing hot available. I am not a fussy person when it comes to food. But paying 149 Euros I would expect some hot food, even if it was only a Hanburger, and served on a proper plate!
Regarding presentation, I like your spoken commentary. It gives an extra 'personal' character to the video. But this native English-speaker does not understand what you meant by 'a boomer position. ' (The problem you had going through the gate at Gare de Lyon)
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-Eurobazz
You've done it again! Your voiceover is awful. If you can speak English to the same level as Thom (Dutch) of TRA (Trains are awesome) and Josh Cahill (German, then it's acceptable. You stopped doing voiceovers a couple of years ago and we've enjoyed reading your sub-titles so why did you spoil it by returning to voiceovers? You have an exemplary YT platform but now you've spoilt it. You may say I can always choose the YT sub-titles but they are crude and would be another irritant. I'm not the only person making this comment so it would be nice if you took notice of this very important aspect of your presentation.
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You've done it again! Your voiceover is awful. If you can speak English to the same level as Thom (Dutch) of TRA (Trains are awesome) and Josh Cahill (German, then it's acceptable. You stopped doing voiceovers a couple of years ago and we've enjoyed reading your sub-titles so why did you spoil it by returning to voiceovers? You have an exemplary YT platform but now you've spoilt it. You may say I can always choose the YT sub-titles but they are crude and would be another irritant. I'm not the only person making this comment so it would be nice if you took notice of this very important aspect of your presentation.
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train
Having travelled on tgv(sud est) sets paris gare de lyon-geneva, 2008, strasbourg paris est, Luxembourg-paris est, still prefer the sud est sets, been on duplex sets which are impressive to travel, but sncf are missing out on the market, fs, renfe, dB, eurostar are well advanced in encroaching the sncf network, yes tgv goes to, ch, de be, it, es, lux, but better service from there competitors is drawing business away, obb railjet 1st class is very good, travelled from zurich-innsbruck, --39, for 3. 5 hrs, also night jet sleeper obb has worked very hard, made it a brilliant branding since2016.
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Having travelled on tgv(sud est) sets paris gare de lyon-geneva, 2008, strasbourg paris est, Luxembourg-paris est, still prefer the sud est sets, been on duplex sets which are impressive to travel, but sncf are missing out on the market, fs, renfe, dB, eurostar are well advanced in encroaching the sncf network, yes tgv goes to, ch, de be, it, es, lux, but better service from there competitors is drawing business away, obb railjet 1st class is very good, travelled from zurich-innsbruck, --39, for 3. 5 hrs, also night jet sleeper obb has worked very hard, made it a brilliant branding since2016.
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train
I often ride the TGV to go from Valence-TGV or Lyon to Montpellier or vice versa, it's fine but I hate that the luggage stacks are full when I go to Montpellier and I have a huge suitcase, and also not a fan of the higher storey, it feels a bit crampted.
However I've taken it once from Paris to Bordeaux and it was so cool (maybe because I was in First Class lol) there was so much leg room and I liked how recent the trainset is
(Also used it to do some Annecy-Paris, Lyon-Paris and Bordeaux-basque country)
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I often ride the TGV to go from Valence-TGV or Lyon to Montpellier or vice versa, it's fine but I hate that the luggage stacks are full when I go to Montpellier and I have a huge suitcase, and also not a fan of the higher storey, it feels a bit crampted.
However I've taken it once from Paris to Bordeaux and it was so cool (maybe because I was in First Class lol) there was so much leg room and I liked how recent the trainset is
(Also used it to do some Annecy-Paris, Lyon-Paris and Bordeaux-basque country)
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-JordanVTheWorld
I enjoy taking first class on LNER in the UK, try it some time if you can, prices are surprisingly affordable on some routes. They offer three menu levels, including full hot meals. I've enjoyed an English breakfast and tea with complimentary refills before, on proper plates with proper cutlery. It feels very premium, and the seats are very comfortable too. If British railways can accommodate that, I see no reason why French railways can't!
Also, really enjoying the new style, please keep it up!
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I enjoy taking first class on LNER in the UK, try it some time if you can, prices are surprisingly affordable on some routes. They offer three menu levels, including full hot meals. I've enjoyed an English breakfast and tea with complimentary refills before, on proper plates with proper cutlery. It feels very premium, and the seats are very comfortable too. If British railways can accommodate that, I see no reason why French railways can't!
Also, really enjoying the new style, please keep it up!
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-prostakuk
Not even premium category, but Ceske Drahy and PKP dining cars have normal crockery and metal cutlery with all meals. And that's the Czechs, not really known as a culinary hotspot! It's really sad, I think most people have a similar experience but all my life I'd wanted to ride the TGV, particularly the old orange ones but the Duplexes are nice too. Anyway, to finally go, try the dining car and realise everything's cold, tastes like a motorway buffet in England, and even can't get coffee right is so sad.
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Not even premium category, but Ceske Drahy and PKP dining cars have normal crockery and metal cutlery with all meals. And that's the Czechs, not really known as a culinary hotspot! It's really sad, I think most people have a similar experience but all my life I'd wanted to ride the TGV, particularly the old orange ones but the Duplexes are nice too. Anyway, to finally go, try the dining car and realise everything's cold, tastes like a motorway buffet in England, and even can't get coffee right is so sad.
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-Lodai974
This is how to lose 30 places in 1st in TGVs which are not enough to support demand.
The Frecciarossa do not have the same role, because they have a capacity much lower than a duplex TGV in single formation. Their entire strategy is based on comfort.
The line is so busy that booking 24 hours in advance means -hoping- to find a seat for more than -150 in second class.
In fact what they are doing will be better suited to a trip of more than 4 hours such as the future Paris Milan in 100% HSL
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This is how to lose 30 places in 1st in TGVs which are not enough to support demand.
The Frecciarossa do not have the same role, because they have a capacity much lower than a duplex TGV in single formation. Their entire strategy is based on comfort.
The line is so busy that booking 24 hours in advance means -hoping- to find a seat for more than -150 in second class.
In fact what they are doing will be better suited to a trip of more than 4 hours such as the future Paris Milan in 100% HSL
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-trained_4_life
Great video - I really enjoy your content. I prefer voice over as I can concentrate on the pictures which are missed viewing subtitles. Your English is very good but unlike many other languages it is spoken more slowly so I have a real problem following it. I know this is an English 'thing' but I am sure this would be appreciated by many of your other English speaking followers. Great videos and looking forward to future journeys however you present them.
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Great video - I really enjoy your content. I prefer voice over as I can concentrate on the pictures which are missed viewing subtitles. Your English is very good but unlike many other languages it is spoken more slowly so I have a real problem following it. I know this is an English 'thing' but I am sure this would be appreciated by many of your other English speaking followers. Great videos and looking forward to future journeys however you present them.
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-maxart3392
A very informative video, but the sound is awful, I could barely follow you. Well, I find this service highly overpriced, especially for a 2 hour ride (2nd class with no catering would do the same job without much of a sacrifice, maybe it would make sense if you went all the way to NIce, but maybe not even that. Anyway, Frecciarossa wins. One more thing: if these trains are newly refurbished, why didn't they provide a decent access for the disabled?
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A very informative video, but the sound is awful, I could barely follow you. Well, I find this service highly overpriced, especially for a 2 hour ride (2nd class with no catering would do the same job without much of a sacrifice, maybe it would make sense if you went all the way to NIce, but maybe not even that. Anyway, Frecciarossa wins. One more thing: if these trains are newly refurbished, why didn't they provide a decent access for the disabled?
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train
I really loved the orange and grey TGV sud est 1st generation and the single level TGV that was first introduced on the Paris Montparnasse 1&2 to Bordeaux with their various styles of seating which was ahead of its time. Im not so sure about the double-decker trains. In the early days the train stopped at Lyon Brotteaux and Lyon Perrache before the opening of Lyon Part Dieu which was an eyesore of its brutalist era when it opened.
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I really loved the orange and grey TGV sud est 1st generation and the single level TGV that was first introduced on the Paris Montparnasse 1&2 to Bordeaux with their various styles of seating which was ahead of its time. Im not so sure about the double-decker trains. In the early days the train stopped at Lyon Brotteaux and Lyon Perrache before the opening of Lyon Part Dieu which was an eyesore of its brutalist era when it opened.
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-stewartrivers4208
I have livedin France vor 40 years and I conclude that SNCF has declined year on year. They have these half-hearted attempts at service but lack any commercial accumen. At the bottom of the ladder is the Intercity between Clermont and Bercy. Have you tried it? Would appreciate your insight. In any case keep up the great videos.
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I have livedin France vor 40 years and I conclude that SNCF has declined year on year. They have these half-hearted attempts at service but lack any commercial accumen. At the bottom of the ladder is the Intercity between Clermont and Bercy. Have you tried it? Would appreciate your insight. In any case keep up the great videos.
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-kentakiman_gmd
Hi! I am wondering, does TGV Duplex have any accessibility for wheelchair to help them board on the train and skip the stairs? I recently found the duplex Max Shinkansen in Japan have small elevators in the inside for people who need it, but I guess it is only possible there because highspeed trains in Asia are wider.
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Hi! I am wondering, does TGV Duplex have any accessibility for wheelchair to help them board on the train and skip the stairs? I recently found the duplex Max Shinkansen in Japan have small elevators in the inside for people who need it, but I guess it is only possible there because highspeed trains in Asia are wider.
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-mirtomano
Freciarossa is just on an another level. I tried the executive and the buisiness premiere and even the freciarossa lower classes (like the buisiness/buisiness allegro class) are ten times better than the sncf buisiness premiere btw freciarossa is rarely late.
So freciarossa is just better
/
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Freciarossa is just on an another level. I tried the executive and the buisiness premiere and even the freciarossa lower classes (like the buisiness/buisiness allegro class) are ten times better than the sncf buisiness premiere btw freciarossa is rarely late.
So freciarossa is just better
/
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-gildone84
Nice job. I don't understand why SNCF doesn't do a better job. It seems Frecciarossa offers a better product in both France and Spain. On a different and minor note. in the context you were using, it's -lose-, not -loose-. English is a strange language, I know. -
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Nice job. I don't understand why SNCF doesn't do a better job. It seems Frecciarossa offers a better product in both France and Spain. On a different and minor note. in the context you were using, it's -lose-, not -loose-. English is a strange language, I know. -
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train
Thanks.
But speaking of food in France: Sorry, but in the last 40 years, I really never have experienced fine and high quality food in France.
But speaking of it: Wherever I am, I look out for an Indian restaurant. Never have I been disappointed.
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Thanks.
But speaking of food in France: Sorry, but in the last 40 years, I really never have experienced fine and high quality food in France.
But speaking of it: Wherever I am, I look out for an Indian restaurant. Never have I been disappointed.
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-metro119
Never think lounges are a big selling point - half the point of taking the train is that you don-t need to turn up early and therefore don-t need a lounge! Food presentation looks poor, even LNER and Avanti in the UK offer better than this.
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Never think lounges are a big selling point - half the point of taking the train is that you don-t need to turn up early and therefore don-t need a lounge! Food presentation looks poor, even LNER and Avanti in the UK offer better than this.
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-FlyingMaxFr
It will take many many years for SNCF to catch up to competition. Best way to learn is for them to lose market shares overtime. Learn painfully, shaking the management heads very hard looks like the only option to improve service.
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It will take many many years for SNCF to catch up to competition. Best way to learn is for them to lose market shares overtime. Learn painfully, shaking the management heads very hard looks like the only option to improve service.
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-bennyfactor
Your note about baggage storage availability is very useful! I have not ridden the current Frecciarossa with large bags but the older ETR500 tren italia high speed sets didn't have a lot of space for airline-checked luggage.
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Your note about baggage storage availability is very useful! I have not ridden the current Frecciarossa with large bags but the older ETR500 tren italia high speed sets didn't have a lot of space for airline-checked luggage.
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-Manawatu_Al2844
The added competition will be putting the pressure to SNCF to finally pick up the service and offer better seats, etc to compete. Right now, they're stake, and haven't been pushed by a competitor in it's own backyard.
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The added competition will be putting the pressure to SNCF to finally pick up the service and offer better seats, etc to compete. Right now, they're stake, and haven't been pushed by a competitor in it's own backyard.
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-one_under_all
New x2000 has the best interior IMO! It-s cosy, has warm lights, & every seat on the whole train can decline automatically, which is Better than executive class. But premier-s giant table & mirror are enticing: )
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New x2000 has the best interior IMO! It-s cosy, has warm lights, & every seat on the whole train can decline automatically, which is Better than executive class. But premier-s giant table & mirror are enticing: )
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-robyoungquist5803
It-s a definite NO from me. I travel Frecciarossa Executive Class whenever I-m in Italy. It-s absolutely wonderful. And SCNF Business -Premiere- can-t hold a candlestick to Frecciarossa Executive Class. -
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It-s a definite NO from me. I travel Frecciarossa Executive Class whenever I-m in Italy. It-s absolutely wonderful. And SCNF Business -Premiere- can-t hold a candlestick to Frecciarossa Executive Class. -
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-blarfroer8066
That legroom is genuinely atrocious. I like booking standard premiere on trains because I'm almost 2m tall. But this doesn't look like you get anymore legroom that second class. What's the point?
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That legroom is genuinely atrocious. I like booking standard premiere on trains because I'm almost 2m tall. But this doesn't look like you get anymore legroom that second class. What's the point?
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-rehurekj
and here im in UK paying like 70pounds for 100miles ride in normal train in normal second class seat( and knowing first class would easily cost double or more with no food and no high speed.
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and here im in UK paying like 70pounds for 100miles ride in normal train in normal second class seat( and knowing first class would easily cost double or more with no food and no high speed.
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train
I like your content but not so much the narration; it makes the videos way less -relaxed- to view and makes it feel rushed.
But please keep making content! Thanks.
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I like your content but not so much the narration; it makes the videos way less -relaxed- to view and makes it feel rushed.
But please keep making content! Thanks.
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-samtrak1204
Paris-Lyon
TGV vs. Frecciarossa
Great commparisons and history lesson. SNCF management should be required to watch this video at each morning briefing.
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Paris-Lyon
TGV vs. Frecciarossa
Great commparisons and history lesson. SNCF management should be required to watch this video at each morning briefing.
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-doc7austin
good video review; I am certainly not going to book business premier, this looks like a rip-off; the same meal can be bought in cafe car, isn't it?
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good video review; I am certainly not going to book business premier, this looks like a rip-off; the same meal can be bought in cafe car, isn't it?
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-uncipaws7643
They should take out one or two seat rows in that section and increase the distance between rows. I like the size of the tables though.
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They should take out one or two seat rows in that section and increase the distance between rows. I like the size of the tables though.
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-scottc1589
I've taken Trenitalia's Executive Class. It is unbelievably wonderful. In my experience it was better than first class on most airlines!
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I've taken Trenitalia's Executive Class. It is unbelievably wonderful. In my experience it was better than first class on most airlines!
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-Shuttletrain
Still can-t believe that France has no respect for the disabled community. The disabled are asking for full access or barrier free.
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Still can-t believe that France has no respect for the disabled community. The disabled are asking for full access or barrier free.
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-jfmezei
For First class product, SNCF should give you a coupon to get into Le Train Bleu at Gare de Lyons instead of a lounge access.
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For First class product, SNCF should give you a coupon to get into Le Train Bleu at Gare de Lyons instead of a lounge access.
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-skyatmz4457
For me, I would rather buy a first class ticket and get a hot meal at Le Bar. The Business Premiere is not worth it.
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For me, I would rather buy a first class ticket and get a hot meal at Le Bar. The Business Premiere is not worth it.
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-ceaabe
Around ten years ago, there was also a meal included in first class TGV Est between Paris and Stuttgart/Munich/Frankfurt.
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Around ten years ago, there was also a meal included in first class TGV Est between Paris and Stuttgart/Munich/Frankfurt.
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