AI vs Artist (or AI + Artist) - Draftsmen S1E27 - Proko
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Date: 2022-03-14
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Comments and reviews: 10
Anomen
I'm honored Proko tried to explain what Starcraft is, but he flopped a little.
(In a professional setting) It's 1 vs 1, two players competing against each other. Each one plays as one of the three available races. They have to build and protect a strong economy and create an army to defeat the other player. That's the simplest way to put it.
What the deep mind AI has managed to do is impressive, beating the best players in the world and although it does still cheat in some ways and it's not a fair game for the humans, you can't deny how far AI has come from its early days.
Also, it can, in fact, be beaten, not only by the best players in the world but by much worse players. It's still a machine that cannot think by itself and using any weird strategy that isn't in its database against it will completely throw it off, while the human players could have easily reacted and made up a new strategy on the fly.
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I'm honored Proko tried to explain what Starcraft is, but he flopped a little.
(In a professional setting) It's 1 vs 1, two players competing against each other. Each one plays as one of the three available races. They have to build and protect a strong economy and create an army to defeat the other player. That's the simplest way to put it.
What the deep mind AI has managed to do is impressive, beating the best players in the world and although it does still cheat in some ways and it's not a fair game for the humans, you can't deny how far AI has come from its early days.
Also, it can, in fact, be beaten, not only by the best players in the world but by much worse players. It's still a machine that cannot think by itself and using any weird strategy that isn't in its database against it will completely throw it off, while the human players could have easily reacted and made up a new strategy on the fly.
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Metin
Thanks for finding my comment worthy to discuss! My point was, art is not always the end-product, but a reaction to some thing. It's more of an idea than just its physical attributes. Good Art is not just a a revolutionary way of visualising something, but also a milestone in human expression, and the reasons that created those needs. Duchamp's 'readymade' would be a good example for my argument. Even if AI surprises me with revelations everyday, I could only put those works under one category such as 'generative art'. Because I believe Art with capital A is the only thing that exclusively belongs to human expression, it's our sentimental footprints as a specie throughout the history of mankind. Made me super happy to hear my own comment in your podcast! And thank you Marshall
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Thanks for finding my comment worthy to discuss! My point was, art is not always the end-product, but a reaction to some thing. It's more of an idea than just its physical attributes. Good Art is not just a a revolutionary way of visualising something, but also a milestone in human expression, and the reasons that created those needs. Duchamp's 'readymade' would be a good example for my argument. Even if AI surprises me with revelations everyday, I could only put those works under one category such as 'generative art'. Because I believe Art with capital A is the only thing that exclusively belongs to human expression, it's our sentimental footprints as a specie throughout the history of mankind. Made me super happy to hear my own comment in your podcast! And thank you Marshall
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Zan
I'm a little concerned with the brushing off of concern than AI are built with biases as something that they can inevitably overcome - can they? They still exist in our world, are built by people and would engage with socials systems all overflowing with biases. They may be able to smooth out some of the obvious problems (AI Cameras not detecting more than just white people) but the fundamental underlying issue will always be the case: They are built by humans who have biases. You can't magically program that out, just as much as you can't magically remove biases from science, for example. Can you control for it and minimize it? Sure! But it'll always be there. Being aware of it is key, not dismissing it.
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I'm a little concerned with the brushing off of concern than AI are built with biases as something that they can inevitably overcome - can they? They still exist in our world, are built by people and would engage with socials systems all overflowing with biases. They may be able to smooth out some of the obvious problems (AI Cameras not detecting more than just white people) but the fundamental underlying issue will always be the case: They are built by humans who have biases. You can't magically program that out, just as much as you can't magically remove biases from science, for example. Can you control for it and minimize it? Sure! But it'll always be there. Being aware of it is key, not dismissing it.
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Javier
I know that in a community like U. S could sound weird but maybe the artesanal stuff, not only artwork, everything. Could adquiere value, In Mexico and in many countries still we do things like our ancestres and it have a value in diferent ways. I'm Civil Engineer and maybe in the future the AI could build and design buildings better that everyone but we could sell artesan buildings with some kind of value using some aspect of IA to improved. We do that somekind now using software that 20 years ago the people doesn't used. SO! I think we dont have to be scared IA, we just have to do what ever we had done. Go ahead, learn from our advances, take advantage from that and Adapt!
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I know that in a community like U. S could sound weird but maybe the artesanal stuff, not only artwork, everything. Could adquiere value, In Mexico and in many countries still we do things like our ancestres and it have a value in diferent ways. I'm Civil Engineer and maybe in the future the AI could build and design buildings better that everyone but we could sell artesan buildings with some kind of value using some aspect of IA to improved. We do that somekind now using software that 20 years ago the people doesn't used. SO! I think we dont have to be scared IA, we just have to do what ever we had done. Go ahead, learn from our advances, take advantage from that and Adapt!
reply
by
The existence of art is due to the expression of human feelings I wander. Will there be computers with feelings? Or since they are information collectors they will use knowledge of psychology to simulate emotions? and if isn't that a bit psycho?
And why a computer would do art? And What if humans reacted to a piece created by a computer where would it be the authenticity of the artistic expression in human artists?
by the way. great talk!
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The existence of art is due to the expression of human feelings I wander. Will there be computers with feelings? Or since they are information collectors they will use knowledge of psychology to simulate emotions? and if isn't that a bit psycho?
And why a computer would do art? And What if humans reacted to a piece created by a computer where would it be the authenticity of the artistic expression in human artists?
by the way. great talk!
reply
isorropia
Hey stan, you mentioned amazon picking data and you asked -how you get that ability for artist-. Well, you got websites such as artstation that if decided to gather data on what you like or dislike, maybe an AI will be abtle pick what you like. Instagram on the search page certenly knows which artist I am gonna like since ever I go to the search feed, I find things I like. I think gathering data might not be that hard.
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Hey stan, you mentioned amazon picking data and you asked -how you get that ability for artist-. Well, you got websites such as artstation that if decided to gather data on what you like or dislike, maybe an AI will be abtle pick what you like. Instagram on the search page certenly knows which artist I am gonna like since ever I go to the search feed, I find things I like. I think gathering data might not be that hard.
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allluckyseven
Quick side thought on the smartphone and its relation to the original telephone (-33: 00, -could you imagine we could have this? - Yeah, no. BUT. A smartphone is much more of a pocket computer that you can incidentally make voice calls than it is a telephone. Making voice calls is, nowadays anyway, such a tiny function of that device it's hard to me to even call it a phone.
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Quick side thought on the smartphone and its relation to the original telephone (-33: 00, -could you imagine we could have this? - Yeah, no. BUT. A smartphone is much more of a pocket computer that you can incidentally make voice calls than it is a telephone. Making voice calls is, nowadays anyway, such a tiny function of that device it's hard to me to even call it a phone.
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Jessica
Proko and Marshall, I actually have a UPRIGHT posture correction, I'm currently using for 2 weeks now and it works, doesn't get in your way at all because you have a specific time to stay in a good posture, the thing is to do it every day in 20 minutes or so and you automatically will correct the posture yourself.
Super recommend that to everyone
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Proko and Marshall, I actually have a UPRIGHT posture correction, I'm currently using for 2 weeks now and it works, doesn't get in your way at all because you have a specific time to stay in a good posture, the thing is to do it every day in 20 minutes or so and you automatically will correct the posture yourself.
Super recommend that to everyone
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Niluili
I was just practising some gesture drawings and as always I cant get them right at all and for some reason I thought how nice it would be if there was some way that I could see how it should look like an then I thought that a trained AI should be able to create a gesture drawing based on a picture and that would be such a helpful tool: D
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I was just practising some gesture drawings and as always I cant get them right at all and for some reason I thought how nice it would be if there was some way that I could see how it should look like an then I thought that a trained AI should be able to create a gesture drawing based on a picture and that would be such a helpful tool: D
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V-n-Hi-u
Elon Musk, the guy who promoted such -brilliant tech projects- as the Hyperloop (a glorified train track, the Boring tunnel (a glorified tunnel for Tesla cars) and SpaceX fast travel rockets (a glorified bad idea, worries about carelessness? Elon Musk, the tech CEO who compares C---D lockdowns to f--cism, wants more regulation?
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Elon Musk, the guy who promoted such -brilliant tech projects- as the Hyperloop (a glorified train track, the Boring tunnel (a glorified tunnel for Tesla cars) and SpaceX fast travel rockets (a glorified bad idea, worries about carelessness? Elon Musk, the tech CEO who compares C---D lockdowns to f--cism, wants more regulation?
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