What would-ve changed if Julius Caesar had survived?
video description
Kingdom of Sabo, or Sabino in Esperia Minor, then Italy; Sabino the founder of the Sabine nation. The son of Sanco, or Sabasio, king of Thrace, migrated with a colony of Sabi. -
The Thracians themselves were called Sapei in certain places, from where the name Sabini probably originated. -
About the pelasgians Niccol P Corcia wrote (Della venuta dei pelasgi in Italy 1839) who considered them from the Tracian tribe; Vincenzo Natale (Ancient History of Sicily, Naples 1843) and Nemesio Ricci (Prische colony della Sabina, Ripatransone 1846)-
-S. Italy - Vannucci-
The acient greeks also took words and deities from thracians and passed them to romans. Dacians were just thracian getic tribes from what is called today Trasylvania/Ardeal area and they became the dominant thracians over other thracians during thracan king Burebista and the kingdom was called Dacia after them while the other thracians were called dacians but they had their own tribal names, dacians also called theself Daoi and Geta, there were also celtae and sarmatians part of the kingdom of Burebista and kingdm was bigger than u see in this video and the expansions over celts and the destructionof some othe celtic tribes and in south of Danube conquereing the greek towns around black sea raiding the roman occupied illyria.\r\n
Date: 2023-12-16
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Comments and reviews: 29
-atticusp6592
If his Eastern conquistadors were successful then Rome would have stronger trade and more access to silver so they'd be considerably richer especially seeing that them conquering Egypt was basically inevitable although it'd happen later. That basically means they wouldn't have the trade deficit with India and given their far greater access to wealth it meant they could afford a far larger army so you're likely to see even more conquests in Europe and the East, so an even larger Roman Empire that's even more powerful. If Augustus succeeds Caesar you're likely to see the conquest of Egypt and Germania, where you'd see the East more broadly ran like how Egypt was where the Senatorial class needed permission to enter Egypt from the Emperor where it's governor would be from the Equestrian class.
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If his Eastern conquistadors were successful then Rome would have stronger trade and more access to silver so they'd be considerably richer especially seeing that them conquering Egypt was basically inevitable although it'd happen later. That basically means they wouldn't have the trade deficit with India and given their far greater access to wealth it meant they could afford a far larger army so you're likely to see even more conquests in Europe and the East, so an even larger Roman Empire that's even more powerful. If Augustus succeeds Caesar you're likely to see the conquest of Egypt and Germania, where you'd see the East more broadly ran like how Egypt was where the Senatorial class needed permission to enter Egypt from the Emperor where it's governor would be from the Equestrian class.
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-bobg5362
Conquering Dacia a 150ish years sooner than Trajan and pushing the Parthian border to maybe a line running from the Caspian Sea to the Persian Gulf would have been huge. Aside from the slaves and territory that would be captured, another 150 years of Rome mining the gold and silver of Dacia would have added tremendous wealth to her coffers. It might have also enticed the Romans to push the northern frontier to the Elbe, Oder or even Vistula river to protect Dacia's northwestern flank. Likewise the resource squandering campaigns against Parthia in the second century would likely not have been needed. Rome would have been in a much stronger position when the barbarians game a calling, either forestalling the timing of or even partially mitigating the collapse of the West.
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Conquering Dacia a 150ish years sooner than Trajan and pushing the Parthian border to maybe a line running from the Caspian Sea to the Persian Gulf would have been huge. Aside from the slaves and territory that would be captured, another 150 years of Rome mining the gold and silver of Dacia would have added tremendous wealth to her coffers. It might have also enticed the Romans to push the northern frontier to the Elbe, Oder or even Vistula river to protect Dacia's northwestern flank. Likewise the resource squandering campaigns against Parthia in the second century would likely not have been needed. Rome would have been in a much stronger position when the barbarians game a calling, either forestalling the timing of or even partially mitigating the collapse of the West.
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-mike-mz6yz
I think Anthony is too old to be a successor if caesar lives. You dont look for a trusted friend a few years younger then you right? More likely he grooms octavian more and adopts him while still alive. How this would influence Octavian is really interesting to think about. Caesar I dont think saw himself as starting an empire, but fixing the republic so would he want the senate to have more power when he leaves office? would he retire at some point or hold onto power until his death?
Also how would having a son in Egypt effect everything? There are way too many what ifs to figure out. One thing for sure though, seeing how many legions there were in the civil wars after his death I dont think raising troops would have been a problem.
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I think Anthony is too old to be a successor if caesar lives. You dont look for a trusted friend a few years younger then you right? More likely he grooms octavian more and adopts him while still alive. How this would influence Octavian is really interesting to think about. Caesar I dont think saw himself as starting an empire, but fixing the republic so would he want the senate to have more power when he leaves office? would he retire at some point or hold onto power until his death?
Also how would having a son in Egypt effect everything? There are way too many what ifs to figure out. One thing for sure though, seeing how many legions there were in the civil wars after his death I dont think raising troops would have been a problem.
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-DieNextInLINE
Did you forget that Octavian was in Greece preparing for Caesar's campaign? If Caesar had stayed alive, Octavian most likely would have had even more prestige added to his name. No doubt Caesar had planned on grooming Octavian even more on this campaign. With that in mind, we might actually see a more militarily minded Octavian. This, coupled with his political acumen would have made him an absolute forces to be reckoned with. Especially if he still had Agrippa at his side. In fact, if Caesar had died during the Parthian campaign and Octavian been responsible for avenging him and bringing his body back to Rome to be deified, I think we would have seen the transition to an Empire much quick, to be honest.
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Did you forget that Octavian was in Greece preparing for Caesar's campaign? If Caesar had stayed alive, Octavian most likely would have had even more prestige added to his name. No doubt Caesar had planned on grooming Octavian even more on this campaign. With that in mind, we might actually see a more militarily minded Octavian. This, coupled with his political acumen would have made him an absolute forces to be reckoned with. Especially if he still had Agrippa at his side. In fact, if Caesar had died during the Parthian campaign and Octavian been responsible for avenging him and bringing his body back to Rome to be deified, I think we would have seen the transition to an Empire much quick, to be honest.
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-atticusp6592
As for a Parthian conquest, something Caesar did that was incredibly effective was actually working with and including the different Leadership classes of people he interacted with, say for example he beat the Parthian's enough times good chances are that they'd lose support from the Elite, while I don't necessarily see Caesar integrating them into Senate (they would certainly have not been as Romanised as the Gallic Leadership was) I could imagine him setting up a number of client states instead to help manage his conquered territory and provide him tribute, manpower and supplies for further conquests.
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As for a Parthian conquest, something Caesar did that was incredibly effective was actually working with and including the different Leadership classes of people he interacted with, say for example he beat the Parthian's enough times good chances are that they'd lose support from the Elite, while I don't necessarily see Caesar integrating them into Senate (they would certainly have not been as Romanised as the Gallic Leadership was) I could imagine him setting up a number of client states instead to help manage his conquered territory and provide him tribute, manpower and supplies for further conquests.
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-l. lawliet164
At this point there are nobody who could challenge Caesar in the military realm. Remember how fast He -I saw, I came and I conquer. -. He Would Finish Dacia campaign roughly 3 years, Parthia another 3 years and more 4 to connect back to home. would be a 10 yet campaign in which he could die most likely in the last 4 years. He would bait this kingdoms if apparently weakness, but would be in the top.
Another thing would be the empire last more centuries and get way bigger as time pass. Probably it would not fall in 476 and be a empire for more centuries.
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At this point there are nobody who could challenge Caesar in the military realm. Remember how fast He -I saw, I came and I conquer. -. He Would Finish Dacia campaign roughly 3 years, Parthia another 3 years and more 4 to connect back to home. would be a 10 yet campaign in which he could die most likely in the last 4 years. He would bait this kingdoms if apparently weakness, but would be in the top.
Another thing would be the empire last more centuries and get way bigger as time pass. Probably it would not fall in 476 and be a empire for more centuries.
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-joeclay9683
Caesar failed in britain not militarily but logistically, so to think he could annex a massive empire that neighbored the very outskirts of the roman empire is impossible. the parthians wouldn't just bend over when Caesar was done spanking Persian butts for a couple of years, they would wait until he was gone before taking back what they lost.
and to think that strolling through eastern europe where nomadic hordes lived and thinking everything would go fine is naive at best.
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Caesar failed in britain not militarily but logistically, so to think he could annex a massive empire that neighbored the very outskirts of the roman empire is impossible. the parthians wouldn't just bend over when Caesar was done spanking Persian butts for a couple of years, they would wait until he was gone before taking back what they lost.
and to think that strolling through eastern europe where nomadic hordes lived and thinking everything would go fine is naive at best.
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-Amadeus8484
I would wager that Augustus would still have taken power as he was Caesar's heir and adopted son. The only major change would be that Marc Antony might have lived longer as Augustus's ally rather than enemy. Cleopatra of course might have remained a liability for him but Caesar might have found a way to make it seem like he was Romanizing Egypt. As it was, Caesar was old and way living on borrowed time so Augustus would have likely still taken power anyway.
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I would wager that Augustus would still have taken power as he was Caesar's heir and adopted son. The only major change would be that Marc Antony might have lived longer as Augustus's ally rather than enemy. Cleopatra of course might have remained a liability for him but Caesar might have found a way to make it seem like he was Romanizing Egypt. As it was, Caesar was old and way living on borrowed time so Augustus would have likely still taken power anyway.
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-andrasbeke3012
If Caesar managed to live and use his influence to solidify Octavian's place as the Emperor, the whole Roman world would be massively changed. By the simple fact that the next Civil wars may have been averted, hundreds of thousands of romans wouldn't have died. Tens of thousands drowned off of the coast of Sicily, no blockade of Italy which nearly starved the peninsula into submission, no showdown between Marc Antony and Octavian near Greece.
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If Caesar managed to live and use his influence to solidify Octavian's place as the Emperor, the whole Roman world would be massively changed. By the simple fact that the next Civil wars may have been averted, hundreds of thousands of romans wouldn't have died. Tens of thousands drowned off of the coast of Sicily, no blockade of Italy which nearly starved the peninsula into submission, no showdown between Marc Antony and Octavian near Greece.
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-moviemonster2083
I can't help but always ask when questions like this are supposedly theoretically posed: so what? Alternate History is fantasy as it didn't happen nor can happen now. And it tends to portray the entire history of human activity as a fight between Great Men, each one trying to grab the entire world for themselves and whatever they supposedly stand for which is usually unlimited power. Look at what that has done to the planet.
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I can't help but always ask when questions like this are supposedly theoretically posed: so what? Alternate History is fantasy as it didn't happen nor can happen now. And it tends to portray the entire history of human activity as a fight between Great Men, each one trying to grab the entire world for themselves and whatever they supposedly stand for which is usually unlimited power. Look at what that has done to the planet.
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-atticusp6592
It's worth mentioning by the Dacian King was assassinated not too long after Caesar was and I'd imagine Caesar would take a month or two to deal with the aftermath of his attempted assassination so good chances are he'd head into Dacia right as it was fragmented and could take it comparatively easily piecemeal, most likely allying with one of the tribes and networking with the Dacian leadership.
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It's worth mentioning by the Dacian King was assassinated not too long after Caesar was and I'd imagine Caesar would take a month or two to deal with the aftermath of his attempted assassination so good chances are he'd head into Dacia right as it was fragmented and could take it comparatively easily piecemeal, most likely allying with one of the tribes and networking with the Dacian leadership.
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-atticusp6592
When it does come to scenarios like this you do hear very often he'd have them executed which I don't see as being out of line with his character but I recall another scenario being described where he does a public show of mercy as to further bolster his popularity and he basically puts the Assassins under house arrest under the pretext of needing to protect from the angry populous.
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When it does come to scenarios like this you do hear very often he'd have them executed which I don't see as being out of line with his character but I recall another scenario being described where he does a public show of mercy as to further bolster his popularity and he basically puts the Assassins under house arrest under the pretext of needing to protect from the angry populous.
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-atticusp6592
Although something interesting about the Eastern conquests you may well see a shift to the East even more quickly in this timeline out of necessity where you'd see the state in whatever form it took more and more operating out of Antioch it'd be that far east, that and there was simply more wealth in the East so you're likely to see conquests leading into India.
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Although something interesting about the Eastern conquests you may well see a shift to the East even more quickly in this timeline out of necessity where you'd see the state in whatever form it took more and more operating out of Antioch it'd be that far east, that and there was simply more wealth in the East so you're likely to see conquests leading into India.
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-chrisdjernaes9658
Had Caeser conquered Dacia and or Parthia, Romes Economy would have grown 5x or more. Caeser-s transition of Rome from Republic to Empire would have changed the very nature and trajectory of the Roman Vision and Culture and the men required to lead it. Caeser always wanted to surpass his idol, Alexander the Great.
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Had Caeser conquered Dacia and or Parthia, Romes Economy would have grown 5x or more. Caeser-s transition of Rome from Republic to Empire would have changed the very nature and trajectory of the Roman Vision and Culture and the men required to lead it. Caeser always wanted to surpass his idol, Alexander the Great.
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-MehranHayati885
Some HUGE questions of history have simple humanely answers which are TOO SIMPLE to believe!
Cesar failed just because of his policies in Egypt!
Rome found out Cesar would have sacrificed every single one of them in order to be the next Alexander
so they did what they did to him
They were feared.
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Some HUGE questions of history have simple humanely answers which are TOO SIMPLE to believe!
Cesar failed just because of his policies in Egypt!
Rome found out Cesar would have sacrificed every single one of them in order to be the next Alexander
so they did what they did to him
They were feared.
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-dustyk103
I think you severely underestimate the abilities of Julius Caesar. He has already crushed many competent leaders. And, if you remember, Alexander conquered all of Persia in three battles. The last of which he, too, was outnumbered many times just as Caesar often was.
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I think you severely underestimate the abilities of Julius Caesar. He has already crushed many competent leaders. And, if you remember, Alexander conquered all of Persia in three battles. The last of which he, too, was outnumbered many times just as Caesar often was.
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-tabarestan8516
Always in the land of aryans king never die and his land kept maybe in a short time lose it but they take it back the history prove it. and if you see now the whole middle east is waiting for a war which is the war of land of aryans iran whit the west
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Always in the land of aryans king never die and his land kept maybe in a short time lose it but they take it back the history prove it. and if you see now the whole middle east is waiting for a war which is the war of land of aryans iran whit the west
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-ploptart4649
Since we're letting our imaginations run wild: Anthony becomes the new dictator or just just straight up princeps, marries cleopatra, and the combined armies of Rome and Egypt invade Parthia, avenging Crassus.
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Since we're letting our imaginations run wild: Anthony becomes the new dictator or just just straight up princeps, marries cleopatra, and the combined armies of Rome and Egypt invade Parthia, avenging Crassus.
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knowledgia
One thing you forgot in Dacia is that Burabista was assassinated the same or the year before Caesar, which led to the collapse of Dacia. So he could've very easily exploited that and taken over the region
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One thing you forgot in Dacia is that Burabista was assassinated the same or the year before Caesar, which led to the collapse of Dacia. So he could've very easily exploited that and taken over the region
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-skeletorrobo
Minimum, Caesar was after honour for the loss of Eagles under Crassus, that Augustus eventually regained. Caesar was intent on the subjugation of the Parthian King, or the devastation of his prestige.
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Minimum, Caesar was after honour for the loss of Eagles under Crassus, that Augustus eventually regained. Caesar was intent on the subjugation of the Parthian King, or the devastation of his prestige.
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-CartoonHistory
What would have been more important to the empire becoming what it did was Octavian. As long as he remained the successor, we're all good. Needed his political genius (and homicidal ruthlessness)
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What would have been more important to the empire becoming what it did was Octavian. As long as he remained the successor, we're all good. Needed his political genius (and homicidal ruthlessness)
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-nikostoss1199
What about Cesarion though? If Caesar wasn't assassinated, Caesarion probably wouldn't be as well. So might he not be the most obvious choice for succession instead of Octavian?
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What about Cesarion though? If Caesar wasn't assassinated, Caesarion probably wouldn't be as well. So might he not be the most obvious choice for succession instead of Octavian?
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-sepantamino3938
Cesear would be kill in sight when he face with General. Surena of Parthia
Parthian tactics was still unknown for ghe Roman till after Mark Antony heavy loss to the Parthian
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Cesear would be kill in sight when he face with General. Surena of Parthia
Parthian tactics was still unknown for ghe Roman till after Mark Antony heavy loss to the Parthian
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knowledgia
I'm a little disappointed that they only showed the alternate history of when Ceaser was Alive, and not the aftermath of these conquests and wars with Dacia and Parthia.
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I'm a little disappointed that they only showed the alternate history of when Ceaser was Alive, and not the aftermath of these conquests and wars with Dacia and Parthia.
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-nathandunlap3039
Well the mongrels would have crossed that mountain and they were more hurgery than the romaine senate and took over.
GANG US Chong is as no joke lol 1. 5.
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Well the mongrels would have crossed that mountain and they were more hurgery than the romaine senate and took over.
GANG US Chong is as no joke lol 1. 5.
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-Falzan362
saw a comment on star wars where someone gave a speech if cesear survived assassination and used palpatine speech as a base and thought it seemed adequate.
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saw a comment on star wars where someone gave a speech if cesear survived assassination and used palpatine speech as a base and thought it seemed adequate.
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-user-up4uy1ov2r
yes, Rome could have defeated the Kingdom of Iran three times, of course, in the dream because we saw it all fail, and every time it attacked Iran,
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yes, Rome could have defeated the Kingdom of Iran three times, of course, in the dream because we saw it all fail, and every time it attacked Iran,
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-geordiejones5618
This dude wanted to die in battle I think. Some think he planned to campaign around the Black Sea and into Germania because he was getting sick.
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This dude wanted to die in battle I think. Some think he planned to campaign around the Black Sea and into Germania because he was getting sick.
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-1293ST
caeser just casually strolling over the caucasus and through germania and then back over the alps. You people do realize that boats are a thing right?
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caeser just casually strolling over the caucasus and through germania and then back over the alps. You people do realize that boats are a thing right?
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