Ragusea method for pizza dough no scale (plus month-old dough)
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Date: 2023-10-27
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Comments and reviews: 20
Sylvia-Rusty;
0: 55 On this, you can also go a bit past that up to a pt, and add more yeasty flavour by addin dead yeast in there (can just boil it and kill it; you murderer (i mean, its probs even worse to breed it just to murder its future generations when ya bake it)
The dead yeast will also make the live yeast in there better at their job bcuz the live yeast will quickly consume the dead ones for nutrients; cute little yeast cannibals, aint they. Those nutrients include some that are not usually found in your typical dough, which is what gives it that boost in both complex yeast flavour compounds and yeast activity
This is smth that is much better understood scientifically in the world of brewin than it is in bakin, just bcuz theres a lot more data to go off of there with so many yeasts in common brewin methods compared to the common bakin methods which arent rly carin about diff yeasts and how to get more flavour out of the yeasts either; bcuz most baked goods arent made to have any particularly atrong yeasty flavour.
Most consumers dont prefer that, at least thats what commercial bakers overwhelmingly believe to be true based on all available evidence they have to go on
There is some good science on the fact it promotes yeast activity tho, and its smth easily observable to any potential baker by simply mixin flour water and yeast together, and usin dead yeast & live yeast in one, and just live in another. Let them do their thing and compare.
Such an experimenter cud even then smell the doughs and note any diffs in terms of aromatic compounds that have been created that can impact flavour, and then ofc follow up by bakin and comparin all the usual things
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0: 55 On this, you can also go a bit past that up to a pt, and add more yeasty flavour by addin dead yeast in there (can just boil it and kill it; you murderer (i mean, its probs even worse to breed it just to murder its future generations when ya bake it)
The dead yeast will also make the live yeast in there better at their job bcuz the live yeast will quickly consume the dead ones for nutrients; cute little yeast cannibals, aint they. Those nutrients include some that are not usually found in your typical dough, which is what gives it that boost in both complex yeast flavour compounds and yeast activity
This is smth that is much better understood scientifically in the world of brewin than it is in bakin, just bcuz theres a lot more data to go off of there with so many yeasts in common brewin methods compared to the common bakin methods which arent rly carin about diff yeasts and how to get more flavour out of the yeasts either; bcuz most baked goods arent made to have any particularly atrong yeasty flavour.
Most consumers dont prefer that, at least thats what commercial bakers overwhelmingly believe to be true based on all available evidence they have to go on
There is some good science on the fact it promotes yeast activity tho, and its smth easily observable to any potential baker by simply mixin flour water and yeast together, and usin dead yeast & live yeast in one, and just live in another. Let them do their thing and compare.
Such an experimenter cud even then smell the doughs and note any diffs in terms of aromatic compounds that have been created that can impact flavour, and then ofc follow up by bakin and comparin all the usual things
reply
spatnaspolecnost
Recently been to Naples. couple of points and opinions:
They don't seem to rise dough in cold, usually they make it on the same day and rise it in room temperature.
I haven't been to any posh pizza restaurants, but usual places don't ferment them as much as I like.
For my pizza I really just prefer 8-12 hours of room temp ferment, balling, 2-3 hours of rise and it's ready to go.
I have become increasingly convinced that kneading dough is nonsense. I have tried the method one of the restaurants in Naples uses - mixing in the last bit of water at the end. ugh let me tell you it took me 40 minutes to make that dough and made no difference to the end product. They did have really nice pizza actually, but without a food processor seems like a completely pointless practice. Regular kneading also makes no perceptible difference to my pizzas. I just do quick mix, half an hour autolise, fold, half an hour and fold again if I remember, 8-12 hours room temp rise, balling etc. No problems with 70% hydration dough with the most basic flour.
One thing I suspect is that flour over here in Europe (Czech Republic) is different than in US, I have tried specific flour for neapolitan pizza and while I think it was way better than some usual flours, I managed to find couple of flours that behave almost the same. Coincidentally they were the cheapest flours one can buy here.
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Recently been to Naples. couple of points and opinions:
They don't seem to rise dough in cold, usually they make it on the same day and rise it in room temperature.
I haven't been to any posh pizza restaurants, but usual places don't ferment them as much as I like.
For my pizza I really just prefer 8-12 hours of room temp ferment, balling, 2-3 hours of rise and it's ready to go.
I have become increasingly convinced that kneading dough is nonsense. I have tried the method one of the restaurants in Naples uses - mixing in the last bit of water at the end. ugh let me tell you it took me 40 minutes to make that dough and made no difference to the end product. They did have really nice pizza actually, but without a food processor seems like a completely pointless practice. Regular kneading also makes no perceptible difference to my pizzas. I just do quick mix, half an hour autolise, fold, half an hour and fold again if I remember, 8-12 hours room temp rise, balling etc. No problems with 70% hydration dough with the most basic flour.
One thing I suspect is that flour over here in Europe (Czech Republic) is different than in US, I have tried specific flour for neapolitan pizza and while I think it was way better than some usual flours, I managed to find couple of flours that behave almost the same. Coincidentally they were the cheapest flours one can buy here.
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Cebo
My most recent pizza experiment has been to use my mother's sourdough starter instead of yeast. It had a similar flavor as leaving the dough in the fridge for a week, if not even more flavorful, since it was pre-inoculated with the lactic acid bacteria of the starter, even though it was only fermented over a single night. It was really really good. Obviously it's not particularly doable unless you already have a starter, but since I do, I think I'm going to use it going forward.
I ended up making several regular NY style pizzas as well as a white pizza, inspired by a roman style sourdough pizza place near me that has this awesome white pizza they call Bianca. It uses a mix of a garlic bechamel, for which I just copied Adam's own garlic white pizza sauce, and ricotta for the sauce. They use fresh mozz but I just used the WMLM mozz I already had for the other pies, plus halved cherry tomatoes, basil, chili flake, and a drizzle of balsamic vinegar. It's possibly my favorite pizza of all time which feels almost sacrilegious as a NY'er, but it's insanely good and surprisingly not that hard to make at home.
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My most recent pizza experiment has been to use my mother's sourdough starter instead of yeast. It had a similar flavor as leaving the dough in the fridge for a week, if not even more flavorful, since it was pre-inoculated with the lactic acid bacteria of the starter, even though it was only fermented over a single night. It was really really good. Obviously it's not particularly doable unless you already have a starter, but since I do, I think I'm going to use it going forward.
I ended up making several regular NY style pizzas as well as a white pizza, inspired by a roman style sourdough pizza place near me that has this awesome white pizza they call Bianca. It uses a mix of a garlic bechamel, for which I just copied Adam's own garlic white pizza sauce, and ricotta for the sauce. They use fresh mozz but I just used the WMLM mozz I already had for the other pies, plus halved cherry tomatoes, basil, chili flake, and a drizzle of balsamic vinegar. It's possibly my favorite pizza of all time which feels almost sacrilegious as a NY'er, but it's insanely good and surprisingly not that hard to make at home.
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Renax
I started out making your old dough recipe, its evolved to basically this, just with a stand mixer.
I omit the stage of splitting it into parts before proofing, just rise it in the mixing bowl for a few days. mostly because I make enough dough for 6-7 pizza's at once and just can't be bothered with 6-7 different bowls. I'll just split them before I start preparing the fillings and that works fine for me.
We used to buy ready made dough but the pizzas I get from this is just so much better I'll never go back.
Then the whole family makes one pizza each with whatever they want for fillings, and the leftovers makes awesome pizza bread for a snack later in the evening or the next day, sometimes its never used and I'll just mix it into next weeks batch, just hold back a bit on the yeast in that case.
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I started out making your old dough recipe, its evolved to basically this, just with a stand mixer.
I omit the stage of splitting it into parts before proofing, just rise it in the mixing bowl for a few days. mostly because I make enough dough for 6-7 pizza's at once and just can't be bothered with 6-7 different bowls. I'll just split them before I start preparing the fillings and that works fine for me.
We used to buy ready made dough but the pizzas I get from this is just so much better I'll never go back.
Then the whole family makes one pizza each with whatever they want for fillings, and the leftovers makes awesome pizza bread for a snack later in the evening or the next day, sometimes its never used and I'll just mix it into next weeks batch, just hold back a bit on the yeast in that case.
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Olle
Adam! I appreciate your videos and experiments. You keep it simple and understandable for the common person to work in the kitchen. I like your way of working by feel, and not having to bring out scales or measuring tools all the time, because that's how we usually work when we cook a family dinner, or pizzas, or braised short ribs. Also! You are looking very good these days, keep up the good work! Both in the gym and in the kitchen/workspace pumping out videos! Sincerely from Sweden, Olle: -)
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Adam! I appreciate your videos and experiments. You keep it simple and understandable for the common person to work in the kitchen. I like your way of working by feel, and not having to bring out scales or measuring tools all the time, because that's how we usually work when we cook a family dinner, or pizzas, or braised short ribs. Also! You are looking very good these days, keep up the good work! Both in the gym and in the kitchen/workspace pumping out videos! Sincerely from Sweden, Olle: -)
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Abdou
I m only at like a fifth of the vid, but what s the point of measuring if, most likely, you WILL have to adjust based on feel/experience based on the products you re using. You will never get the exact same results if you followed the exact same recipe with ingredients from different parts of the world, even if the difference is pretty slight that s besides the idea, using senses especially is way superior imo.
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I m only at like a fifth of the vid, but what s the point of measuring if, most likely, you WILL have to adjust based on feel/experience based on the products you re using. You will never get the exact same results if you followed the exact same recipe with ingredients from different parts of the world, even if the difference is pretty slight that s besides the idea, using senses especially is way superior imo.
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Lukas
I think people put too much emphasis on the type of flour or humidity of the room etc. In my experience, if you get the flour type right (like 00, AP, bread flour) you can usually confidently follow recipes. A couple % of varying hydration won t matter.
Only for higher hydratioons like 70-80% you really have to make sure to use high protein flour.
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I think people put too much emphasis on the type of flour or humidity of the room etc. In my experience, if you get the flour type right (like 00, AP, bread flour) you can usually confidently follow recipes. A couple % of varying hydration won t matter.
Only for higher hydratioons like 70-80% you really have to make sure to use high protein flour.
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Jeanna
If I've got a really wet pizza dough I just spread it out on a piece of parchment paper right on the flat baking sheet I use for a peel. Then it just slides right of with the parchment onto the pizza stone. I'll usually trim the paper so very little protrudes beyond the dough. That's a very hot oven and I don't want the paper igniting!
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If I've got a really wet pizza dough I just spread it out on a piece of parchment paper right on the flat baking sheet I use for a peel. Then it just slides right of with the parchment onto the pizza stone. I'll usually trim the paper so very little protrudes beyond the dough. That's a very hot oven and I don't want the paper igniting!
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op4000exe
I once had a bread dough that had been in the fridge for 1, 5 months. When I took it out (to throw it out honestly, I imagined it'd be. horrifying, but honestly it looked and smelled fine. Sadly I was too much of a coward though and ended up tossing it, but it may very well have been fine to eat after baking.
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I once had a bread dough that had been in the fridge for 1, 5 months. When I took it out (to throw it out honestly, I imagined it'd be. horrifying, but honestly it looked and smelled fine. Sadly I was too much of a coward though and ended up tossing it, but it may very well have been fine to eat after baking.
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Paul
Salt slows fermentation a little, but it also improves the gluten structure. These two facts work together to make better bread since the CO2 is released slowly into dough that can hold it vs just farting out into the kitchen giving you flabby, flatter dough. And saltless bread is sad bread.
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Salt slows fermentation a little, but it also improves the gluten structure. These two facts work together to make better bread since the CO2 is released slowly into dough that can hold it vs just farting out into the kitchen giving you flabby, flatter dough. And saltless bread is sad bread.
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Caleb
Can I just say as a long time Adam Ragusea enjoyer, I love this newer genre of videos, that are in concept the same as the old ones, but In practice both more natural and more jump cut-y to visually Interesting and descriptive shots. Thanks for all the hard work Adam! It looks great!
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Can I just say as a long time Adam Ragusea enjoyer, I love this newer genre of videos, that are in concept the same as the old ones, but In practice both more natural and more jump cut-y to visually Interesting and descriptive shots. Thanks for all the hard work Adam! It looks great!
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Dragon
Hey Adam, great vid! I highly recommend try making pizza dough from the Tassajara Bread Book! The dough is noticeably better imo then other typical yeasted bread dough. Also def reccomend the Tangzhong method. Used it to make yeasted doughnuts & they were WAAAAAY better then others!
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Hey Adam, great vid! I highly recommend try making pizza dough from the Tassajara Bread Book! The dough is noticeably better imo then other typical yeasted bread dough. Also def reccomend the Tangzhong method. Used it to make yeasted doughnuts & they were WAAAAAY better then others!
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Yeop
I do food videos and I feel you. Having to slow down the cooking method to make videos always ends up with subpar results. Then I have to pretend to like what I cook, so there's one video where I just started sautee-ing onions and that's it. I just said, Sometimes I just want to cook.
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I do food videos and I feel you. Having to slow down the cooking method to make videos always ends up with subpar results. Then I have to pretend to like what I cook, so there's one video where I just started sautee-ing onions and that's it. I just said, Sometimes I just want to cook.
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food
funny, the more pizza I make, I find it easier to measure the ingredients. 70% hydration, 2% salt, maybe some oil. chuck it together, stir it, maybe knead it an hour later, leave it for a day. no adding flour or thinking. Replicates every time. I have no time for for pfaffing about.
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funny, the more pizza I make, I find it easier to measure the ingredients. 70% hydration, 2% salt, maybe some oil. chuck it together, stir it, maybe knead it an hour later, leave it for a day. no adding flour or thinking. Replicates every time. I have no time for for pfaffing about.
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Erixus25
Why not put the dough directly on the oven tray? Instead of starting out on the wooden board and then sliding it onto the tray. Do we need a hot tray for some reason? I've been doing it this way for a while now and the pizza comes out as delicious as always, just less mess.
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Why not put the dough directly on the oven tray? Instead of starting out on the wooden board and then sliding it onto the tray. Do we need a hot tray for some reason? I've been doing it this way for a while now and the pizza comes out as delicious as always, just less mess.
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deep
these recent casual style of videos, while not my preference admittably, have been a lovely treat the effort and work you put into these shows in every beat of the video, and I appreciate that you tend to put in a little extra thing or two to give the videos some heterogineity
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these recent casual style of videos, while not my preference admittably, have been a lovely treat the effort and work you put into these shows in every beat of the video, and I appreciate that you tend to put in a little extra thing or two to give the videos some heterogineity
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Future
When I see you doing this (handling a simple dough) I remember your food science videos. I wish you still made them. I'd have liked to have your take on seitan, why it works texture-wise, which cultures came up with similar items, and how fake meats have evolved over time.
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When I see you doing this (handling a simple dough) I remember your food science videos. I wish you still made them. I'd have liked to have your take on seitan, why it works texture-wise, which cultures came up with similar items, and how fake meats have evolved over time.
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Paul
Try semolina (italian semola) instead of flour for stretching out the pizza. You can use as much as you want without getting the dough to floury and it slides off you pizza peel like a charm.
Not sure about availability in the US though but it is definitely worth a try!
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Try semolina (italian semola) instead of flour for stretching out the pizza. You can use as much as you want without getting the dough to floury and it slides off you pizza peel like a charm.
Not sure about availability in the US though but it is definitely worth a try!
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xd
OMG i was literally just making homemade pizza for my family, (im 17) and i needed a dough recipe, and i clicked the pizza playlist, and i couldn t even believe my eyes when i saw 37 minutes ago for DOUGH
thank you lol saved my life, truly a Ragusea miracle
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OMG i was literally just making homemade pizza for my family, (im 17) and i needed a dough recipe, and i clicked the pizza playlist, and i couldn t even believe my eyes when i saw 37 minutes ago for DOUGH
thank you lol saved my life, truly a Ragusea miracle
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CuteLittleHen
One of your finest videos as of late, Adam! The pacing, the relaxed yet informative and relatable manner that you transferred your knowledge and experience really shun through this one.
Thank you for streamlining pizza making to the home.
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One of your finest videos as of late, Adam! The pacing, the relaxed yet informative and relatable manner that you transferred your knowledge and experience really shun through this one.
Thank you for streamlining pizza making to the home.
reply
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