What Is A Luxury Car? Can A Kia Compete?
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Date: 2019-05-30
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Comments and reviews: 10
Rick Sizemore
Ive had a 5 series, and X5s, continuously since 1993, minus one stint in an M3. But after my 2013 lease was up, I picked up a K900, it was a 2015 in Jan 2016, and Ive been pretty happy. I wanted a naturally aspirated V8, and Kia was basically giving these away at the time, 25k off of sticker, so what the heck. Its been good, I liked the styling more than an Equus, very Lexus/German clone, and everything seems to be bolted together well, at least Honda/Acura level. I did have a problem with a wheel/tire just not balancing right at 75-80mph, but they replaced all 4 sets and used a the dealer groups Porsche road force balancer and its been perfect. The dealer experience is only OK, but the BMW Store in Cincinnati is really quite good, and Ive bought 16 cars through them, so Im sure it says BMW sucker on the profile. From a pure blind perspective, it probably is closer to a current gen Acura than a current German/Lexus, but its also a fairly old car. It feels about as well put together as my 2013 5 series, not as fast as the turbo-6, but I like the feel more of the V8, but youre probably not going to see much more of that around in the future. The ride is great, with one caveat. On smooth roads, its fantastic, if its a bit bumpy, or with potholes, its also very nice, but there is a sort of brittleness, jarring almost, over specifically concrete expansion joints, bridge transitions. It almost feels like the BMWs with early run-flats, but without the run-flats. The Nav/UI is fine, the map detail is not great, but BMW does a pretty good job with theirs. Overall, 90% as good the last gen of the luxury market, way better than Lincoln or Cadillac, Id say better than Acura or Infiniti too. My wife just got a new E400 wagon, and that interior does seem a step above, maybe two, but it doesnt look like this new K900 is far off, still 25k cheaper. Ill have to look at the new K900, and maybe a Genesis G90 too, especially if they end up being so unpopular that they offering huge deals again. I really dont care about the brand, and if folks avoid it because of that, Ill be happy to take advantage of the bad business decision by Kia.
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Ive had a 5 series, and X5s, continuously since 1993, minus one stint in an M3. But after my 2013 lease was up, I picked up a K900, it was a 2015 in Jan 2016, and Ive been pretty happy. I wanted a naturally aspirated V8, and Kia was basically giving these away at the time, 25k off of sticker, so what the heck. Its been good, I liked the styling more than an Equus, very Lexus/German clone, and everything seems to be bolted together well, at least Honda/Acura level. I did have a problem with a wheel/tire just not balancing right at 75-80mph, but they replaced all 4 sets and used a the dealer groups Porsche road force balancer and its been perfect. The dealer experience is only OK, but the BMW Store in Cincinnati is really quite good, and Ive bought 16 cars through them, so Im sure it says BMW sucker on the profile. From a pure blind perspective, it probably is closer to a current gen Acura than a current German/Lexus, but its also a fairly old car. It feels about as well put together as my 2013 5 series, not as fast as the turbo-6, but I like the feel more of the V8, but youre probably not going to see much more of that around in the future. The ride is great, with one caveat. On smooth roads, its fantastic, if its a bit bumpy, or with potholes, its also very nice, but there is a sort of brittleness, jarring almost, over specifically concrete expansion joints, bridge transitions. It almost feels like the BMWs with early run-flats, but without the run-flats. The Nav/UI is fine, the map detail is not great, but BMW does a pretty good job with theirs. Overall, 90% as good the last gen of the luxury market, way better than Lincoln or Cadillac, Id say better than Acura or Infiniti too. My wife just got a new E400 wagon, and that interior does seem a step above, maybe two, but it doesnt look like this new K900 is far off, still 25k cheaper. Ill have to look at the new K900, and maybe a Genesis G90 too, especially if they end up being so unpopular that they offering huge deals again. I really dont care about the brand, and if folks avoid it because of that, Ill be happy to take advantage of the bad business decision by Kia.
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discerningmind
As always Alex, a great video. Im disappointed that we cantbuy comfortable riding cars as we used too. I completely blame the auto magazine writers as since the 1970s theyve whined about suspension being wallowing and other awful terms. They drilled into our minds that stiff suspension is better. But do I really need rally suspension as I drive under 35 MPH shopping and running my errands? My bones say no. The last inexpensive comfortable car I know of was the last generation of Chevrolet Cavalier. I owned one. The seats were nice and soft, and wrapped in cloth that was nice and soft, and the non low profile tires and suspension rode comfortably. It seems about every car now a daysis built to be uncomfortable. People dont care what it looks like or feels like. They want cars built somethinglike running shoes and the more distractingelectronic gadgetry the better, and black or dark gray--or at least thats what were offerednow. Even with the firmer Americanized suspension I would buy this Kia K900 over any American or European brand. I own a 17 Kia Soul and Ive learned from that what beautifully well made cars theyre capable of building. And I have to say that if my cheapie Kia Soul (compared to this K900) is builtto a gradethat Im pleased withit says a lot about Kia, and where theyre heading. Kia knows they have to do a good job because they have a lot of competition with Japan and upcoming China. Im hearing and reading more about Honda and Toyota slipping toward cheapness and it may have to do with the South Korean offerings. Perhaps were witnessing history where Hyundai/Kia will park themselves intothat high spaceheld by Honda and Toyota for years now.
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As always Alex, a great video. Im disappointed that we cantbuy comfortable riding cars as we used too. I completely blame the auto magazine writers as since the 1970s theyve whined about suspension being wallowing and other awful terms. They drilled into our minds that stiff suspension is better. But do I really need rally suspension as I drive under 35 MPH shopping and running my errands? My bones say no. The last inexpensive comfortable car I know of was the last generation of Chevrolet Cavalier. I owned one. The seats were nice and soft, and wrapped in cloth that was nice and soft, and the non low profile tires and suspension rode comfortably. It seems about every car now a daysis built to be uncomfortable. People dont care what it looks like or feels like. They want cars built somethinglike running shoes and the more distractingelectronic gadgetry the better, and black or dark gray--or at least thats what were offerednow. Even with the firmer Americanized suspension I would buy this Kia K900 over any American or European brand. I own a 17 Kia Soul and Ive learned from that what beautifully well made cars theyre capable of building. And I have to say that if my cheapie Kia Soul (compared to this K900) is builtto a gradethat Im pleased withit says a lot about Kia, and where theyre heading. Kia knows they have to do a good job because they have a lot of competition with Japan and upcoming China. Im hearing and reading more about Honda and Toyota slipping toward cheapness and it may have to do with the South Korean offerings. Perhaps were witnessing history where Hyundai/Kia will park themselves intothat high spaceheld by Honda and Toyota for years now.
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Phil Orion
I owned a BMW 7 Series which was the worst example of a luxury flagship. BMW drive and suspension great but interior ergonomics are crap. Its like they do absolutely no usability testing on their controls and features. The nail in the coffin though was the maintenance - what a total piece of garbage. Ive owned multiple LS 430s, and multiple LS 460s. Very good car, but at near or over 100K today -a little more than I want to spend. I might fork out 100K for a Z06 Corvette but thats about it. I currently own a S550 but the types and number of things that fail on these cars are too numerous to count. I went to test drive a 2015 K900 Luxury Trim, 38K, and still under warranty on a whim. After a test drive I did 3 days of research mostly online (K900 Forum, edmunds, youtube, friends, etc) My conclusion is that this car is under rated in the US market. A pre-owned 2015 K900 is basically the same price as a preowned 2017 Honda Accord. With that as a backdrop I decided to buy one. So far I like it Im impressed with the fit and finish, a cadillac like ride, cloud soft and responsive. Im a convert for now. Check with me in a year. We own a Limo service and I thought how would our clients feel if a chauffeur showed up with this car. What would they think seeing the interior for the first time? Theyd probably think mmmmmm, nice lots of space back here. Ride in it for 30 minutes, mmmm comfortable ride. Definitely worth a look.
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I owned a BMW 7 Series which was the worst example of a luxury flagship. BMW drive and suspension great but interior ergonomics are crap. Its like they do absolutely no usability testing on their controls and features. The nail in the coffin though was the maintenance - what a total piece of garbage. Ive owned multiple LS 430s, and multiple LS 460s. Very good car, but at near or over 100K today -a little more than I want to spend. I might fork out 100K for a Z06 Corvette but thats about it. I currently own a S550 but the types and number of things that fail on these cars are too numerous to count. I went to test drive a 2015 K900 Luxury Trim, 38K, and still under warranty on a whim. After a test drive I did 3 days of research mostly online (K900 Forum, edmunds, youtube, friends, etc) My conclusion is that this car is under rated in the US market. A pre-owned 2015 K900 is basically the same price as a preowned 2017 Honda Accord. With that as a backdrop I decided to buy one. So far I like it Im impressed with the fit and finish, a cadillac like ride, cloud soft and responsive. Im a convert for now. Check with me in a year. We own a Limo service and I thought how would our clients feel if a chauffeur showed up with this car. What would they think seeing the interior for the first time? Theyd probably think mmmmmm, nice lots of space back here. Ride in it for 30 minutes, mmmm comfortable ride. Definitely worth a look.
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trilingualkid
luxury it means brand, heritage, comfort, isolation, top of the line everything. People that think Kia, is a luxury car have obviously never been in a luxurious vehicle. Take the K900 for example, it has everything that a normal would consider luxury, it even has Air suspension, so what makes it different from a Mercedes S class? Alot. Fit and finish, Mercedes fit and finish is just masterful, everything done with precision, cost is not a factor. Top of the line technology, even the rides feel different, the S class Air suspension compare to the Kia Air suspension is night and day. The Isolation to the outside world from an S class is beyond this world, the engine is hand built, the leather and wood dash is hand built, everything is cater to you as the buyer, on the other hand, the Kia is not at this level of sophistication. Dont get me wrong, Kia and Hyundai is doing good, I still have my 09 Genesis V8 and I love it, its my DD but having ride in a Mercedes S AMG, Korean are not there yet, not by a mile. Its like that kid you know in class that do things just to get by, and then theres that kid that go above and beyond, doing extra credits when he already have an A+. When you see a Mercedes S AMG, you know that person has made it in life. When you see a Kia K900, you see that person as just another normal person. Whether thats true or not is not the point, the point is that badge carries meaning behind it.
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luxury it means brand, heritage, comfort, isolation, top of the line everything. People that think Kia, is a luxury car have obviously never been in a luxurious vehicle. Take the K900 for example, it has everything that a normal would consider luxury, it even has Air suspension, so what makes it different from a Mercedes S class? Alot. Fit and finish, Mercedes fit and finish is just masterful, everything done with precision, cost is not a factor. Top of the line technology, even the rides feel different, the S class Air suspension compare to the Kia Air suspension is night and day. The Isolation to the outside world from an S class is beyond this world, the engine is hand built, the leather and wood dash is hand built, everything is cater to you as the buyer, on the other hand, the Kia is not at this level of sophistication. Dont get me wrong, Kia and Hyundai is doing good, I still have my 09 Genesis V8 and I love it, its my DD but having ride in a Mercedes S AMG, Korean are not there yet, not by a mile. Its like that kid you know in class that do things just to get by, and then theres that kid that go above and beyond, doing extra credits when he already have an A+. When you see a Mercedes S AMG, you know that person has made it in life. When you see a Kia K900, you see that person as just another normal person. Whether thats true or not is not the point, the point is that badge carries meaning behind it.
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Stephen Hendricks
Brand snobbery is a way to sell a vehicle but its not the only way. In a relatively short time Kia has moved from an economy brand (to put it diplomatically) to a value brand and more and more to being perceived as a smart buy brand. And that applies to the full range of models KIA offers. First the Stinger, now the K900 and soon the Telluride crossover all add a prestige aura to the brand as a whole. And though the K900 wont sell by the bucketload in the US (as it will in China, for exampe) the fact that its on the showroom floor will draw customers into dealers (just as the Stinger already does) And when potential customers come in, theyll find the new Forte, the excellent midsize Optima, and the very attractive Sorento. In other words, for a manufacturer a halo model contributes more to the bottom line than just through its sales, alone. And Kia will soon have three halo models to draw customers. Furthermore, as the brand image continues to improve, so will the resale reputation. Its already happening. I recently traded a 2012 Sorento for a 2018 model for less than 1000 below the KBB market price of a comparable 2012 Toyota Highlander. Considering that I purchased the 2012 vehicle for approximately 7000 less than the Highlander price at that time, I came out significantly ahead.
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Brand snobbery is a way to sell a vehicle but its not the only way. In a relatively short time Kia has moved from an economy brand (to put it diplomatically) to a value brand and more and more to being perceived as a smart buy brand. And that applies to the full range of models KIA offers. First the Stinger, now the K900 and soon the Telluride crossover all add a prestige aura to the brand as a whole. And though the K900 wont sell by the bucketload in the US (as it will in China, for exampe) the fact that its on the showroom floor will draw customers into dealers (just as the Stinger already does) And when potential customers come in, theyll find the new Forte, the excellent midsize Optima, and the very attractive Sorento. In other words, for a manufacturer a halo model contributes more to the bottom line than just through its sales, alone. And Kia will soon have three halo models to draw customers. Furthermore, as the brand image continues to improve, so will the resale reputation. Its already happening. I recently traded a 2012 Sorento for a 2018 model for less than 1000 below the KBB market price of a comparable 2012 Toyota Highlander. Considering that I purchased the 2012 vehicle for approximately 7000 less than the Highlander price at that time, I came out significantly ahead.
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Isaac Yoon
I think luxury is defined by what you pay for it. Even if president obama and bill gates drove k900 and said it was good luxury car. at the end it is just a good value. a smart luxury value. poeple pay 20k for birkin bag. it is just leather bag probably same as any m. kors bag or kate spade bag. but just the fact that a person can blow that money on such a item make it a luxury item. if k900 came out and was priced at 900k. it would be a luxury car because not many people could afford it. lets face it, the rear looks like bentley and has kia family look at the front and is priced competitively to steal buyers from mid level pseudo luxury japanese sedan(like many say here) or in some rare cases german car shoppers. I am not saying it is not a good car, it probably is. this luxury argument is irrelevent. I never owned a super car but, driven many from civic dx to amg vehicles. looking back, my first car was the best car. it def wasnt luxury vehicle, it was used, probaly abused, no power steering, no abs. but I have most dear memories from owning it. idea of luxury feeds on people who only have desire for something that they can not afford. really. it is just a car.
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I think luxury is defined by what you pay for it. Even if president obama and bill gates drove k900 and said it was good luxury car. at the end it is just a good value. a smart luxury value. poeple pay 20k for birkin bag. it is just leather bag probably same as any m. kors bag or kate spade bag. but just the fact that a person can blow that money on such a item make it a luxury item. if k900 came out and was priced at 900k. it would be a luxury car because not many people could afford it. lets face it, the rear looks like bentley and has kia family look at the front and is priced competitively to steal buyers from mid level pseudo luxury japanese sedan(like many say here) or in some rare cases german car shoppers. I am not saying it is not a good car, it probably is. this luxury argument is irrelevent. I never owned a super car but, driven many from civic dx to amg vehicles. looking back, my first car was the best car. it def wasnt luxury vehicle, it was used, probaly abused, no power steering, no abs. but I have most dear memories from owning it. idea of luxury feeds on people who only have desire for something that they can not afford. really. it is just a car.
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tjs114
I think Kia (and Hyundai) both suffer from the same problem when it comes to entering the luxury market. They are both viewed as value brands and value and luxury rarely fit together. VW, before they tried to self destruct with TDI-gate, had the same problem. Remember the CC and the Phaeton? Both were hard pressed to find a market when dropped on a VW lot next to Beetles, Golfs and Jettas. A luxury car shopper is going to frown when walking into the local Kia dealership and get a face full of hamsters and Souls and Fortes while the (maybe) one K900 and half-dozen Stingers are hidden somewhere in the lot. I think this is why Genesis isnt doing as well as Hyundai hoped- they havent divorced the product lots. Remember when Acura was launched as a subsection of the Honda dealerships? Less than a year later and they were in stand alone dealerships NOT next door to the Honda dealer. If Kia & Hyundai want to play in the luxury market, maybe they need to open separate dealerships for their luxury brands. Since Kia & Hyundai are kissing cousins, let them share a luxury dealership network.
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I think Kia (and Hyundai) both suffer from the same problem when it comes to entering the luxury market. They are both viewed as value brands and value and luxury rarely fit together. VW, before they tried to self destruct with TDI-gate, had the same problem. Remember the CC and the Phaeton? Both were hard pressed to find a market when dropped on a VW lot next to Beetles, Golfs and Jettas. A luxury car shopper is going to frown when walking into the local Kia dealership and get a face full of hamsters and Souls and Fortes while the (maybe) one K900 and half-dozen Stingers are hidden somewhere in the lot. I think this is why Genesis isnt doing as well as Hyundai hoped- they havent divorced the product lots. Remember when Acura was launched as a subsection of the Honda dealerships? Less than a year later and they were in stand alone dealerships NOT next door to the Honda dealer. If Kia & Hyundai want to play in the luxury market, maybe they need to open separate dealerships for their luxury brands. Since Kia & Hyundai are kissing cousins, let them share a luxury dealership network.
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Steven Joe
Im genuinely impressed by the new K900 and Kia has proven they can do a luxury car, just as well if not better for the price as the competition and if I were In the market for a full sized luxury sedan I would certainly look at the K900 first. However, the average consumer wouldnt due to the stigma still attached to the Kia brand and overall purchase and ownership experience. I totally get that because if Im going to pay 60k for a car I expect an enjoyable and VIP experience, but if you prioritize getting the most car for your money then the K900 is for you. Kia knows this wont be a huge seller for them, and thats not the point, its a halo car demonstrating what the brand is capable of and where they are going. They have priced this car very well and with lease incentives, perhaps it will exceed their paltry sales projections, but if they can change their brand perception in a positive direction it will all be worth it. P. S. Kia, can we pretty please get a Stinger with this level of luxury.
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Im genuinely impressed by the new K900 and Kia has proven they can do a luxury car, just as well if not better for the price as the competition and if I were In the market for a full sized luxury sedan I would certainly look at the K900 first. However, the average consumer wouldnt due to the stigma still attached to the Kia brand and overall purchase and ownership experience. I totally get that because if Im going to pay 60k for a car I expect an enjoyable and VIP experience, but if you prioritize getting the most car for your money then the K900 is for you. Kia knows this wont be a huge seller for them, and thats not the point, its a halo car demonstrating what the brand is capable of and where they are going. They have priced this car very well and with lease incentives, perhaps it will exceed their paltry sales projections, but if they can change their brand perception in a positive direction it will all be worth it. P. S. Kia, can we pretty please get a Stinger with this level of luxury.
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웅이
Its a tough question. Too many factors and they boil down to preferences. If the question is examined in a vacuum, then yes. A Kia, Hyundai, Genesis, etc can compete. And its no longer just the value proposition. These cars are legitimate contenders. But then somebody always (without fail) makes the argument about prestige, the experience, the badge, etc. And not to scoff at those things, but they are also legitimate arguments. When you buy a car, you are not just buying a product but the experience of ownership also. That includes the reputation and I hate to admit it, but status. Which is why I would like to simplify this matter. Real car people would have ZERO problems driving a luxury Kia. You have to be an egomaniac to write off a luxury Kia. Or insecure. My current cars are: 2011 BMW 328i xDrive, 2015 VW GTI, 2018 BMW X3 M40i. My previous cars consist of: 2007 Nissan 350Z, 2012 Hyundai Genesis Coupe. I love and loved every single one of these cars.
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Its a tough question. Too many factors and they boil down to preferences. If the question is examined in a vacuum, then yes. A Kia, Hyundai, Genesis, etc can compete. And its no longer just the value proposition. These cars are legitimate contenders. But then somebody always (without fail) makes the argument about prestige, the experience, the badge, etc. And not to scoff at those things, but they are also legitimate arguments. When you buy a car, you are not just buying a product but the experience of ownership also. That includes the reputation and I hate to admit it, but status. Which is why I would like to simplify this matter. Real car people would have ZERO problems driving a luxury Kia. You have to be an egomaniac to write off a luxury Kia. Or insecure. My current cars are: 2011 BMW 328i xDrive, 2015 VW GTI, 2018 BMW X3 M40i. My previous cars consist of: 2007 Nissan 350Z, 2012 Hyundai Genesis Coupe. I love and loved every single one of these cars.
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Jose Reyes
This car looks great and a great value. Im a proud owner of over priced Benz 2014 GLK with 110k miles. Back at the end of 2015 we wanted to buy a larger SUV for the family and after seeing a video from Alex where he recommended the Sorento, we pull the trigger and got a Sorento for the wife 2015 SX v6, tons of features I could not believe all the crap in it. But all of that is BS if they car turns to shit after 30k miles, rattles weird noises, issues that Kia refuse to addressed because the computer had no code, the dealer knew how to fix it and I could get it fix but out of pocket, my GLK has 110k miles and it drives like day one when i purchased new with 30 miles. Just got the wife a new GLE and she is super happy, over price maybe but built right. So say whatever you want about Benz ( cant speak about other luxury brands) but they know how to build a car and stand behind their car, at least thats my experience.
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This car looks great and a great value. Im a proud owner of over priced Benz 2014 GLK with 110k miles. Back at the end of 2015 we wanted to buy a larger SUV for the family and after seeing a video from Alex where he recommended the Sorento, we pull the trigger and got a Sorento for the wife 2015 SX v6, tons of features I could not believe all the crap in it. But all of that is BS if they car turns to shit after 30k miles, rattles weird noises, issues that Kia refuse to addressed because the computer had no code, the dealer knew how to fix it and I could get it fix but out of pocket, my GLK has 110k miles and it drives like day one when i purchased new with 30 miles. Just got the wife a new GLE and she is super happy, over price maybe but built right. So say whatever you want about Benz ( cant speak about other luxury brands) but they know how to build a car and stand behind their car, at least thats my experience.
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