NVIDIA & AMD Won't Like This: GPU Price Creep, Greed, and Generational Stagnation
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Date: 2021-05-05
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Comments and reviews: 10
Emmanuel
200 price point wouldn't have happened even without the cryptocurrency and GPU demand boom for the simple reason of die size and other costs.
5600X is supposedly 80.7 mm2 of 7nm + 125mm2 of 12nm (much cheaper?).
6700XT is supposedly 335 mm2 of 7nm.
So their GPU is using more than 4 times as much 7nm (more expensive than 12nm by ??) than their CPU, plus the GPU has memory, PCB, power delivery, cooling, and other components.
Though perhaps the price of the Xbox Series S shows they could possibly get there if they cut out the AIBs and sold direct.
Perhaps AMD/Intel will one day approach the 200 market with extra powerful iGPU/APU models.
I would pay extra for a CPU with a 200 class performance iGPU (perhaps with some on package dedicated VRAM).
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200 price point wouldn't have happened even without the cryptocurrency and GPU demand boom for the simple reason of die size and other costs.
5600X is supposedly 80.7 mm2 of 7nm + 125mm2 of 12nm (much cheaper?).
6700XT is supposedly 335 mm2 of 7nm.
So their GPU is using more than 4 times as much 7nm (more expensive than 12nm by ??) than their CPU, plus the GPU has memory, PCB, power delivery, cooling, and other components.
Though perhaps the price of the Xbox Series S shows they could possibly get there if they cut out the AIBs and sold direct.
Perhaps AMD/Intel will one day approach the 200 market with extra powerful iGPU/APU models.
I would pay extra for a CPU with a 200 class performance iGPU (perhaps with some on package dedicated VRAM).
reply
Blazs120gl
I've been telling this for years now. If the same money can't buy at least 50% uplift in the next generation, that is no progress and not worth paying for. When the GPU mining craze broke out in around 2016, pricing has frozen into 200 USD = around 1060/580 perf (even higher outside US), buying anything more powerful was just a ratiometric increase of performance for the increase in price. After budget buyers have been pushed off the market, megalomanian designs (unsustainable, brute force perf increase, poor consideration for economy/binning/scaling) have taken over. The process is irreversible as NV and AMD can sell its low yield at any price point, thus they don't have to work for the average Joe's 200 bucks anymore.
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I've been telling this for years now. If the same money can't buy at least 50% uplift in the next generation, that is no progress and not worth paying for. When the GPU mining craze broke out in around 2016, pricing has frozen into 200 USD = around 1060/580 perf (even higher outside US), buying anything more powerful was just a ratiometric increase of performance for the increase in price. After budget buyers have been pushed off the market, megalomanian designs (unsustainable, brute force perf increase, poor consideration for economy/binning/scaling) have taken over. The process is irreversible as NV and AMD can sell its low yield at any price point, thus they don't have to work for the average Joe's 200 bucks anymore.
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Jeremy
Always great respect for your approach with quantitative analysis that is really lacking anymore (viewers, please comment with other reputable sources that do this similarly and have been around awhile - LTT isn't the same btw).
It's also important to point out that the whole idea with you're goals, since the start, is taking an approach that follows the scientific process effectively. Your consistency over the years is also noticed (with very subtle aesthetic improvements). You and your team are just solid and I wish there were more people like you, Steve! THANK YOU!
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Always great respect for your approach with quantitative analysis that is really lacking anymore (viewers, please comment with other reputable sources that do this similarly and have been around awhile - LTT isn't the same btw).
It's also important to point out that the whole idea with you're goals, since the start, is taking an approach that follows the scientific process effectively. Your consistency over the years is also noticed (with very subtle aesthetic improvements). You and your team are just solid and I wish there were more people like you, Steve! THANK YOU!
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Tiago
The graphics pipeline is getting harder to accelerate as smaller and smaller efficiencies are chased, AMD and Nvidia are optimizing their GPUs for ML (and mining) so optimization for games suffers, and GPUs used to be on older silicon processes and are now just one node behind the faster CPUs, which made the chips more expensive. Nvidia and AMD won't eat the increase in costs, we'll still buy every GPU they make...
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The graphics pipeline is getting harder to accelerate as smaller and smaller efficiencies are chased, AMD and Nvidia are optimizing their GPUs for ML (and mining) so optimization for games suffers, and GPUs used to be on older silicon processes and are now just one node behind the faster CPUs, which made the chips more expensive. Nvidia and AMD won't eat the increase in costs, we'll still buy every GPU they make...
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Centrifugal
I was dumb when I built my computer. I built it right before the 2000 series, thinking that I could upgrade my 970 for about the same price ( 330). We all know what Nvidia did with pricing there. Then I thought to wait for the 3000 series. Now I've lost all hope for these companies to do the right thing. I'll have to sell my car and and save money from insurance to afford a card f the price keeps shooting up.
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I was dumb when I built my computer. I built it right before the 2000 series, thinking that I could upgrade my 970 for about the same price ( 330). We all know what Nvidia did with pricing there. Then I thought to wait for the 3000 series. Now I've lost all hope for these companies to do the right thing. I'll have to sell my car and and save money from insurance to afford a card f the price keeps shooting up.
reply
Kevin
I really feel like the story here is not that value has stagnated but that over the last fifteen years the CPU and GPU have traded places. A discrete graphics card has gone from being an add-on for a desktop PC whose details were of no great significance to the majority of users, to increasingly its core component, the most indispensable and therefore valuable part of the whole package.
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I really feel like the story here is not that value has stagnated but that over the last fifteen years the CPU and GPU have traded places. A discrete graphics card has gone from being an add-on for a desktop PC whose details were of no great significance to the majority of users, to increasingly its core component, the most indispensable and therefore valuable part of the whole package.
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Eric
If AMD should be licking their lips as Nvidia decides to shoot itself in the foot with cutting the mining capability if their cards. Worrying about a secondary market is pointless. That said I firmly expect AMD to suddenly announce that they too are going to nerf mining performance and hang onto that number three niche, with current nvidia and then old nvidia ahead of AMD.
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If AMD should be licking their lips as Nvidia decides to shoot itself in the foot with cutting the mining capability if their cards. Worrying about a secondary market is pointless. That said I firmly expect AMD to suddenly announce that they too are going to nerf mining performance and hang onto that number three niche, with current nvidia and then old nvidia ahead of AMD.
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SpeedFreak
I am sooo glad I didn't hold out for a 3060 or an expensive 3070. Yeah I would have loved a nvidia card but this rx6700xt I got from amd monday is awesome. I have a 1440p 144hz screen and the 6700xt is perfect for me. It's been years since I have been on a amd card and I am blown away. My last card was a 1070 so It a pretty nice improvement for me.
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I am sooo glad I didn't hold out for a 3060 or an expensive 3070. Yeah I would have loved a nvidia card but this rx6700xt I got from amd monday is awesome. I have a 1440p 144hz screen and the 6700xt is perfect for me. It's been years since I have been on a amd card and I am blown away. My last card was a 1070 so It a pretty nice improvement for me.
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futuremusician728
Having never owned an AMD GPU, their driver problem has been prevalent for years. And I know that just from everyone I ever talked to that had them back when I got my first gaming PC in 2011. Those were the days 4GB of DDR3 RAM and 4GB of VRAM on a GPU were the standard and Intel had just barely begun milking Quad Cores. haha :)
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Having never owned an AMD GPU, their driver problem has been prevalent for years. And I know that just from everyone I ever talked to that had them back when I got my first gaming PC in 2011. Those were the days 4GB of DDR3 RAM and 4GB of VRAM on a GPU were the standard and Intel had just barely begun milking Quad Cores. haha :)
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Nicholas
I've noticed this for a little while but I never could quantify it before. Thanks for compiling all of this data and suffering through the wiki page for the amd gpus. There were some nice products in there, but god my eyes bleed when trying to sort out all of the different branding they had and sorting out the refreshes.
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I've noticed this for a little while but I never could quantify it before. Thanks for compiling all of this data and suffering through the wiki page for the amd gpus. There were some nice products in there, but god my eyes bleed when trying to sort out all of the different branding they had and sorting out the refreshes.
reply
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