Cutting an NVIDIA RTX 4090 in Half with a Water Jet: The Science of Cooling
video description
Date: 2022-10-06
Related videos
Comments and reviews: 15
Morally
Long story short they reinforced the vapor chamber with more internal pillars due to an increase in physical pressure of the vapor chamber onto the PCB. The physical pressure increases were made to eliminate some of the thermal pads. The thermal pads were replaced with actual notch pedestals on the vapor chamber for the VRMs etc. These changes were made for uniformity in terms of contact of the vapor chamber on the dye and other components such as VRMs etc. They made these changes primarily so they could eliminate as many dry spots as possible i.e huge temp variances between all areas in contact with the vapor chamber. This more even heat dispersion allows for the card to maintain higher voltages aka more heat.
Fans were redesigned due to structural differences between the 30 series and 40 series. 4090 is bigger so the fan design for the 3090 wouldnt work as well so they redesigned it and adjusted fan curves accordingly. They used physical prototypes along with 3D modeling and testing to get to the right design etc. They switched out the bearing to better ones for noise levels. They basically kind of perfected the design from the 30 series.
reply
Long story short they reinforced the vapor chamber with more internal pillars due to an increase in physical pressure of the vapor chamber onto the PCB. The physical pressure increases were made to eliminate some of the thermal pads. The thermal pads were replaced with actual notch pedestals on the vapor chamber for the VRMs etc. These changes were made for uniformity in terms of contact of the vapor chamber on the dye and other components such as VRMs etc. They made these changes primarily so they could eliminate as many dry spots as possible i.e huge temp variances between all areas in contact with the vapor chamber. This more even heat dispersion allows for the card to maintain higher voltages aka more heat.
Fans were redesigned due to structural differences between the 30 series and 40 series. 4090 is bigger so the fan design for the 3090 wouldnt work as well so they redesigned it and adjusted fan curves accordingly. They used physical prototypes along with 3D modeling and testing to get to the right design etc. They switched out the bearing to better ones for noise levels. They basically kind of perfected the design from the 30 series.
reply
freeroamer696
Ok guys, how refreshing was it to see a competent person explaining the decisions and problems overcome in the design of the new tech you're contemplating (possibly lusting after, for better or worse. lol) Kudos to GN for serving those of us who are really tired of the marketing arms of a lot of these tech companies. You have tech junkies who have been in this game longer than some of your employees, we want the nitty gritty, and even if its not some gamer fueled marketing blitz, we will still choose your product based on our understanding of the competance you displayed at solving the problems presented to you, because we understand that is what pushes technology forward, overcoming obstacles, and that doesn't always present itself with some new breakthrough, but by a foundational understanding of what is known to us now. I for one put this in my running for all time best breakdowns/explanations. (Also, I hope someone high up at Nvidia took notice of their boy being an actual giga-chad , through foundational knowledge and a willingness to explain in detail. You can'tbuy passion like that.)
reply
Ok guys, how refreshing was it to see a competent person explaining the decisions and problems overcome in the design of the new tech you're contemplating (possibly lusting after, for better or worse. lol) Kudos to GN for serving those of us who are really tired of the marketing arms of a lot of these tech companies. You have tech junkies who have been in this game longer than some of your employees, we want the nitty gritty, and even if its not some gamer fueled marketing blitz, we will still choose your product based on our understanding of the competance you displayed at solving the problems presented to you, because we understand that is what pushes technology forward, overcoming obstacles, and that doesn't always present itself with some new breakthrough, but by a foundational understanding of what is known to us now. I for one put this in my running for all time best breakdowns/explanations. (Also, I hope someone high up at Nvidia took notice of their boy being an actual giga-chad , through foundational knowledge and a willingness to explain in detail. You can'tbuy passion like that.)
reply
nadream
I want to remind or inform commenters here that, as an Engineer, companies and their investors care far more about who is in charge of their money. And while technically (and obviously) the engineers are the ones who actually design what is manufactured and shipped, its those pesky CEOs and CFOs who have the better ear of the investors, boards, etc. Nothing makes more of an impact than money. So if they really REALLY want more of this engineering to shine, then letting nvidia get away with the 4000 series isnt what you want. No one needs to buy 4000 series cards, seriously, do not buy them and trust me, their engineers will be seeing more respect.
reply
I want to remind or inform commenters here that, as an Engineer, companies and their investors care far more about who is in charge of their money. And while technically (and obviously) the engineers are the ones who actually design what is manufactured and shipped, its those pesky CEOs and CFOs who have the better ear of the investors, boards, etc. Nothing makes more of an impact than money. So if they really REALLY want more of this engineering to shine, then letting nvidia get away with the 4000 series isnt what you want. No one needs to buy 4000 series cards, seriously, do not buy them and trust me, their engineers will be seeing more respect.
reply
Alex
Very cool and interesting video. I would have loved to see you guys show Malcolm your fan tester and get his thoughts on Nvidia s testing methodology regarding airflow, but I m sure PR wouldn t want that happening.
I know you said this content piece ditches the marketing, but I m curious to know if you reached out to Nvidia for this content, or if Nvidia reached out to you guys first. With the bad PR Nvidia is receiving regarding their pricing, my first impressions of this are really a cool scientific look into designing, but also a bit of indirect marketing attempting to justify the crazy prices of the 40 series to the public.
reply
Very cool and interesting video. I would have loved to see you guys show Malcolm your fan tester and get his thoughts on Nvidia s testing methodology regarding airflow, but I m sure PR wouldn t want that happening.
I know you said this content piece ditches the marketing, but I m curious to know if you reached out to Nvidia for this content, or if Nvidia reached out to you guys first. With the bad PR Nvidia is receiving regarding their pricing, my first impressions of this are really a cool scientific look into designing, but also a bit of indirect marketing attempting to justify the crazy prices of the 40 series to the public.
reply
Chris
Love the engineering overload. Odd how physics is physics and many of the concepts overlap different specific disciplines. I was an oilfield researcher in my younger days and the rarefied concepts of porosity and permeability were voodoo science (I am talking early '80s here) and now they are discussed in tech heavy but almost mainstream media conversation. This is one of the most enjoyable videos I have watched recently an I hope it is the prelude to many more deeper dives.
reply
Love the engineering overload. Odd how physics is physics and many of the concepts overlap different specific disciplines. I was an oilfield researcher in my younger days and the rarefied concepts of porosity and permeability were voodoo science (I am talking early '80s here) and now they are discussed in tech heavy but almost mainstream media conversation. This is one of the most enjoyable videos I have watched recently an I hope it is the prelude to many more deeper dives.
reply
Neil
Great video... The smile on your face through out reminded me of when I first got access to Nvidia engineers via an job with an OEM just as Tesla M2050 showed up on the horizon..
Definitely interested in when your FAN tester comes online, would be nice, if you also had a sensitive thermal camera to see changes 'visually'.. is it purely 'air flow' or can their be a chamber kinda PC sized that can be monitored?
reply
Great video... The smile on your face through out reminded me of when I first got access to Nvidia engineers via an job with an OEM just as Tesla M2050 showed up on the horizon..
Definitely interested in when your FAN tester comes online, would be nice, if you also had a sensitive thermal camera to see changes 'visually'.. is it purely 'air flow' or can their be a chamber kinda PC sized that can be monitored?
reply
giorx5
Nice! So, nVidia tries hard to defend against the people that say they are greedy by showing off the big cost making coollers? No matter wahat, the R&D cost for FE coolers doesn't justify the extreme increase in pricing. Their GPU naming is scandalous and even bigger than most think. The difference from 4090 to 3080 16GB is almost the same as 3090 vs 3070. So, 4080 16BG=4070 and 4080 12GB is 3060(Ti at best).
reply
Nice! So, nVidia tries hard to defend against the people that say they are greedy by showing off the big cost making coollers? No matter wahat, the R&D cost for FE coolers doesn't justify the extreme increase in pricing. Their GPU naming is scandalous and even bigger than most think. The difference from 4090 to 3080 16GB is almost the same as 3090 vs 3070. So, 4080 16BG=4070 and 4080 12GB is 3060(Ti at best).
reply
Doug
Clearly, Malcolm paid a lot of attention in the thermodynamics portion of his physics courses and it really grabbed him. Loads of really interesting stuff in this video, I'm sure a lot of it went over many viewers' heads (a lot went over my head but I understood a lot of what he was at least trying to get at.) When he's done working for nVidia I could see this guy being a physics professor at a university.
reply
Clearly, Malcolm paid a lot of attention in the thermodynamics portion of his physics courses and it really grabbed him. Loads of really interesting stuff in this video, I'm sure a lot of it went over many viewers' heads (a lot went over my head but I understood a lot of what he was at least trying to get at.) When he's done working for nVidia I could see this guy being a physics professor at a university.
reply
rinserofwinds
i am very happy, that NVIDIA jumped this marketing opportunity since they saw how great the Intel engineer interview turned out.
This is the kind of informative content i like to see and influences my consumer decisions.
I hope we will see more of this, because this piece of content did more for my attitude of NVIDIA than the last 10 years of regular marketing did.
reply
i am very happy, that NVIDIA jumped this marketing opportunity since they saw how great the Intel engineer interview turned out.
This is the kind of informative content i like to see and influences my consumer decisions.
I hope we will see more of this, because this piece of content did more for my attitude of NVIDIA than the last 10 years of regular marketing did.
reply
Cabanur
I feel like Steve could've done a better job at guiding and directing the nVidia engineer towards subjects relevant to the audience. It seems like he just let this young engineer ramble about all the cool and exciting stuff he has to deal with, except what's exciting for an engineer is cryptic for even a computer enthusiast. This was so obvious even the PR guy was lost.
reply
I feel like Steve could've done a better job at guiding and directing the nVidia engineer towards subjects relevant to the audience. It seems like he just let this young engineer ramble about all the cool and exciting stuff he has to deal with, except what's exciting for an engineer is cryptic for even a computer enthusiast. This was so obvious even the PR guy was lost.
reply
All
Hey yall, microscope tip from another validation guy: Sandbag the table your scope is on and put neoprene sheeting underneath it. That will keep your heartbeat from showing up in the video. For irregular samples, keep some play dough or modeling clay handy! Moosh it into the clay, and it won't wobble while you're moving the stage.
Love your work!
reply
Hey yall, microscope tip from another validation guy: Sandbag the table your scope is on and put neoprene sheeting underneath it. That will keep your heartbeat from showing up in the video. For irregular samples, keep some play dough or modeling clay handy! Moosh it into the clay, and it won't wobble while you're moving the stage.
Love your work!
reply
Warmachine
I was grinning like an idiot the entire time I watched this. I know my math well enough, but the thermal engineering--aka the context of the math--is way above my knowledge level. But it does a lot to give that context to how these things are designed and what the minds behind the machine are thinking about when they make their decisions.
reply
I was grinning like an idiot the entire time I watched this. I know my math well enough, but the thermal engineering--aka the context of the math--is way above my knowledge level. But it does a lot to give that context to how these things are designed and what the minds behind the machine are thinking about when they make their decisions.
reply
The
And this guy and the whole team responsible for the cooling of these cards, are just leeches and people that do nothing at all, they just take the work of the jensen and make money from it.
- jensen huang 2022
At least this is what that nasty POS greedy SCUMbag huang said about EVGA and the rest board partners....
reply
And this guy and the whole team responsible for the cooling of these cards, are just leeches and people that do nothing at all, they just take the work of the jensen and make money from it.
- jensen huang 2022
At least this is what that nasty POS greedy SCUMbag huang said about EVGA and the rest board partners....
reply
Yiibster
I do love hearing pro engineers explain facettes of their specific knowledge area with pure enthusiasm! I do not understand cfd at all really. But now I better understand why certain changes are made between the cooler design of the generations of gpu coolers nvidia has designed so far. Thanks Steve!
reply
I do love hearing pro engineers explain facettes of their specific knowledge area with pure enthusiasm! I do not understand cfd at all really. But now I better understand why certain changes are made between the cooler design of the generations of gpu coolers nvidia has designed so far. Thanks Steve!
reply
Henrik
It could be fun to invite similar engineer from AMD. Also let both team's engineers analyse eachother coolers.
Even better let them design a cooler for their revival's. See if amd can make a better 4090 cooler and vise versa.
It will never happen because there is too much business going on.
reply
It could be fun to invite similar engineer from AMD. Also let both team's engineers analyse eachother coolers.
Even better let them design a cooler for their revival's. See if amd can make a better 4090 cooler and vise versa.
It will never happen because there is too much business going on.
reply
Add a review, comment
Other channel videos
