Solid State Cooling Could Revolutionize Thermals
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Date: 2023-01-18
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Comments and reviews: 14
actias
I might get thumbs down for this comment but have to call it for what it really is. Looks like a redesign of piezo jets that are around for many now. The cooling performance is so poor and we already have devices that can cool high power output in very thin bodies such as mbps or g14. Those devices can also run fans off or very silent in indicated power limits like 10-30 watts. So you don't even need these. I can also already imagine that the dust is being real issue for those. Honestly, look like a startup that hopes to get bought by a big company with non-engineer directors.
Also, clearly this guy doesn't know Gordon which only shows how disconnected he is from PC building community.
Thumbs up to Gordon though for his professionalism in this interview.
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I might get thumbs down for this comment but have to call it for what it really is. Looks like a redesign of piezo jets that are around for many now. The cooling performance is so poor and we already have devices that can cool high power output in very thin bodies such as mbps or g14. Those devices can also run fans off or very silent in indicated power limits like 10-30 watts. So you don't even need these. I can also already imagine that the dust is being real issue for those. Honestly, look like a startup that hopes to get bought by a big company with non-engineer directors.
Also, clearly this guy doesn't know Gordon which only shows how disconnected he is from PC building community.
Thumbs up to Gordon though for his professionalism in this interview.
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Darren
I think that the real value is in holding the patents and licensing the patents to multiple manufacturers to create products with those patents. If they try to become the supplier then they will get crushed by fan manufacturers and established contracts for cooling solutions and the established companies in the industry pushing back.
If they licensed their patents and capitalized on those patents they could create a thriving business and make billions. As long as they don't try to make coolers and compete at scale. They're going to get crushed by alternative products. But if they charge reasonable fees for licensing to established manufacturers of cooling solutions they could crush it and dominate the industry.
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I think that the real value is in holding the patents and licensing the patents to multiple manufacturers to create products with those patents. If they try to become the supplier then they will get crushed by fan manufacturers and established contracts for cooling solutions and the established companies in the industry pushing back.
If they licensed their patents and capitalized on those patents they could create a thriving business and make billions. As long as they don't try to make coolers and compete at scale. They're going to get crushed by alternative products. But if they charge reasonable fees for licensing to established manufacturers of cooling solutions they could crush it and dominate the industry.
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British
Festinating. Their website mentions collaboration with Intel and their next Evo laptops.
This marvelous product is good news for all of us, both consumers and manufacturers. However, i hope Frore don't get bogged down with ridiculous first time contracts from early adopters like Intel, as that would kill off early business growth potential. They should license Airjet out on volumes bought and variants required, as this is clearly a product for everyone, not just first time contracts. The early contract money might be tempting but longevity comes from open market strategy. Nobody wants another great idea turning into a hand-tied dud.
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Festinating. Their website mentions collaboration with Intel and their next Evo laptops.
This marvelous product is good news for all of us, both consumers and manufacturers. However, i hope Frore don't get bogged down with ridiculous first time contracts from early adopters like Intel, as that would kill off early business growth potential. They should license Airjet out on volumes bought and variants required, as this is clearly a product for everyone, not just first time contracts. The early contract money might be tempting but longevity comes from open market strategy. Nobody wants another great idea turning into a hand-tied dud.
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Frostie
What''s also amazing and wasn't really mentioned in detail, is that this technology will allow devices to be manufactured with smaller footprint of materials and thus make manufacturing costs go down (not to mention storage costs ) which will help offset the (probably) higher cost of manufacturing these solid state airjet coolers. Additionally the thinner / smaller form factor designs that can come out of this idea will mean that shipping containers can fit more products , even further lowering costs to end users.. I am very excited by this tech and cant wait to see where we are with regard to cooling in a few years time.
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What''s also amazing and wasn't really mentioned in detail, is that this technology will allow devices to be manufactured with smaller footprint of materials and thus make manufacturing costs go down (not to mention storage costs ) which will help offset the (probably) higher cost of manufacturing these solid state airjet coolers. Additionally the thinner / smaller form factor designs that can come out of this idea will mean that shipping containers can fit more products , even further lowering costs to end users.. I am very excited by this tech and cant wait to see where we are with regard to cooling in a few years time.
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Nedski42YT
A few questions that come to mind are:
#1 What is the approximate temperature of the air at the exhaust aperture? All that heat in such a small area must extremely hot.
#2 How is that hot, narrow airstream exhausted from the device case?
#3 MEM's technology is built on a silicon wafer, correct? Semiconductor silicon wafers are extremely expensive even before any layers are etched. So what is the approximate cost per square centimeter of your device?
Thanks. I'll check their website to see if my questions are addressed.
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A few questions that come to mind are:
#1 What is the approximate temperature of the air at the exhaust aperture? All that heat in such a small area must extremely hot.
#2 How is that hot, narrow airstream exhausted from the device case?
#3 MEM's technology is built on a silicon wafer, correct? Semiconductor silicon wafers are extremely expensive even before any layers are etched. So what is the approximate cost per square centimeter of your device?
Thanks. I'll check their website to see if my questions are addressed.
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Eggcopter
This seems really cool (pun) and the thermal saturation factor makes sense, and reducing noise is definitely nice. I'd like to know the endurance of this implementation compared to traditionally fan, which is almost guaranteed to be higher(solid state device vs. fan bearing). Although the 10w seems low at the moment for laptops, I'd like to see 20w for ultrabook, or phones which can't accommodate fans without ear piercing (small fan at high rpm).
Looking forward to phone vendors implementing this asap as they usually do
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This seems really cool (pun) and the thermal saturation factor makes sense, and reducing noise is definitely nice. I'd like to know the endurance of this implementation compared to traditionally fan, which is almost guaranteed to be higher(solid state device vs. fan bearing). Although the 10w seems low at the moment for laptops, I'd like to see 20w for ultrabook, or phones which can't accommodate fans without ear piercing (small fan at high rpm).
Looking forward to phone vendors implementing this asap as they usually do
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Xaltar
My major concern would be durability/longevity. It seems like exactly the kind of tech that could be easily designed to have a predetermined life span and force obsolescence. Don't get me wrong, it's insanely cool tech but you have to wonder. Now if it's marketed as an affordable, user replaceable part, take my money right now. I suspect we will see them bought out by Apple very soon and the tech becoming another slap in the face of RTR, not to mention locked down patents and anti-competition clauses.
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My major concern would be durability/longevity. It seems like exactly the kind of tech that could be easily designed to have a predetermined life span and force obsolescence. Don't get me wrong, it's insanely cool tech but you have to wonder. Now if it's marketed as an affordable, user replaceable part, take my money right now. I suspect we will see them bought out by Apple very soon and the tech becoming another slap in the face of RTR, not to mention locked down patents and anti-competition clauses.
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Akoshus
Pretty sure it works the same way as a piezo-electric fan. And those are REALLY expensive. Unless they find a way to make them in such high quantities it can actually make profit while lowering the cost and make them mainstream, maybe then they can become standard in a lot of devices, but for now in its current state it looks like vaporware to me. Handheld PCs, ultrabooks, lower-end gaming laptops could all benefit from this technology, too bad it's very expensive and difficult to package.
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Pretty sure it works the same way as a piezo-electric fan. And those are REALLY expensive. Unless they find a way to make them in such high quantities it can actually make profit while lowering the cost and make them mainstream, maybe then they can become standard in a lot of devices, but for now in its current state it looks like vaporware to me. Handheld PCs, ultrabooks, lower-end gaming laptops could all benefit from this technology, too bad it's very expensive and difficult to package.
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ZadesLegacy
I love it when a rep knows their product inside and out. I would have asked if it is possible to put this thing in a phone without significant battery drain/noise. What the lifespan of something like this is. As well as what the cost actually is compared to a fan, and shown the cross section in the video.
I also agree with the rep on a lot of things, including the concept that it has been an incredibly long time since any revolutionary idea has taken over the active cooling space.
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I love it when a rep knows their product inside and out. I would have asked if it is possible to put this thing in a phone without significant battery drain/noise. What the lifespan of something like this is. As well as what the cost actually is compared to a fan, and shown the cross section in the video.
I also agree with the rep on a lot of things, including the concept that it has been an incredibly long time since any revolutionary idea has taken over the active cooling space.
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Stein
1W power draw to cool 5W sounds pretty bad
For comparison, a CPU cooler with a 120mm fan at 1500rpm can cool about 150W while also using 1W.
As long as they keep this design (very small intake for a lot of air), I doubt they can improve the efficiency much tbh. It probably takes a lot of energy to force air through that hole.
But it's their first product and I am sure they can come up with something. Definitely nice to see some innovation in the stagnant cooling market.
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1W power draw to cool 5W sounds pretty bad
For comparison, a CPU cooler with a 120mm fan at 1500rpm can cool about 150W while also using 1W.
As long as they keep this design (very small intake for a lot of air), I doubt they can improve the efficiency much tbh. It probably takes a lot of energy to force air through that hole.
But it's their first product and I am sure they can come up with something. Definitely nice to see some innovation in the stagnant cooling market.
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LiveType
This is cool, but the question remains, why wasn't this implemented earlier?
Technology limitations, packaging constraints, it barely works, it costs way too much to be practical? Like these things can't cost more than about 30 each or else manufacturers won't use them.
But otherwise probably the most important hardware innovations of the early decade if it actually works as it 100% enabled devices that were not previously possible.
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This is cool, but the question remains, why wasn't this implemented earlier?
Technology limitations, packaging constraints, it barely works, it costs way too much to be practical? Like these things can't cost more than about 30 each or else manufacturers won't use them.
But otherwise probably the most important hardware innovations of the early decade if it actually works as it 100% enabled devices that were not previously possible.
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Aya
Have these guys ever looked at an old laptop inside and the caked dust and dirt all over fans? Those little slits in this thing and however the inside is I can see getting totally clogged up in weeks or months... I think this thing would need to add some filters or something.
They talk about dust proof but they need to show what that actually is.... not just say you need to put it in a dust resistant enclosure.
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Have these guys ever looked at an old laptop inside and the caked dust and dirt all over fans? Those little slits in this thing and however the inside is I can see getting totally clogged up in weeks or months... I think this thing would need to add some filters or something.
They talk about dust proof but they need to show what that actually is.... not just say you need to put it in a dust resistant enclosure.
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dberry99
Remarkable idea with some serious limitations. Power dissipation limits aside, it looks to be incredibly susceptible to dust. A normal PC fan can get pretty gunked up with crud and still function with slowly dwindling performance. This looks like something that will require an ultra-purified air source to have a hope of living in the real world. It's so small, I doubt a shot of compressed air would unclog it.
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Remarkable idea with some serious limitations. Power dissipation limits aside, it looks to be incredibly susceptible to dust. A normal PC fan can get pretty gunked up with crud and still function with slowly dwindling performance. This looks like something that will require an ultra-purified air source to have a hope of living in the real world. It's so small, I doubt a shot of compressed air would unclog it.
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intuitiv.me
2 questions:
1- dust free? The air that is been moved needs to come from somewhere... so air in means dust. Or are these chips creating new air out of thin air ?
2- Noise: 200 km/h or 140 mp/h this is air moving and through a very thing opening... this looks like a whistle. The wind already makes noise and is only during hurricanes reaches these speeds.
So how does this works?
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2 questions:
1- dust free? The air that is been moved needs to come from somewhere... so air in means dust. Or are these chips creating new air out of thin air ?
2- Noise: 200 km/h or 140 mp/h this is air moving and through a very thing opening... this looks like a whistle. The wind already makes noise and is only during hurricanes reaches these speeds.
So how does this works?
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