10,000 Hours to Master the Piano? - Music Performance
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Date: 2022-03-28
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Comments and reviews: 10
sp4nky66
Great analysis, as always. 10,000 hours is far too low an estimate for piano. Let's say you do an undergrad professional degree in piano performance, practicing 4 quality hours every day for 4 years. That's 5,840 hrs. Then you do an M.M., practicing 6 hrs/day for 2 years. That's 4,380 hrs. Total = 10,220 hours over 6 years. HOWEVER ...
Even to turn in a decent audition for an undergrad program requires a threshold of mastery of both repertoire and technical. For example, if you begin lessons at age 6, 12 years of 2 hrs/day practice -on average- (less time when younger, more when older) is not unusual. In my experience, people with natural talent tend to practice more, not less, so there's probably no shortcut there, at least in terms of hours. So that's a baseline of 8,760 hrs before you even get to undergrad, for a grand total of 18,980 hrs over 18 years--nearly twice Gladwell's figure.
Another issue is that advanced piano repertoire and technical is physically demanding. Nobody just sits down and starts practicing for 2 or 4 or 6 hours a day unless they are determined to injure themselves. You have to develop intelligent and non-injurious practice habits, ramp up to these -serious- amounts of practice, find a -cruising altitude- to carry you forward--and then, never stop. It's also helpful to have a teacher who is not a complete lunatic. In short, there are so many variables unique to each individual and situation that it's difficult to see how Gladwell's figure has any meaningful relevance to music practice. (Or anything else, for that matter.)
A flaw of Gladwell's hypothesis is that by selecting a subset of a discipline's elements, it's possible to curve-fit any discipline to 10,000 hours of practice and call that -mastery-. My rough estimates above use the M.M. as an arbitrary metric; but as more and more schools offer a D.M.A., will that become the new standard of mastery? Is mastery therefore subject to inflation? Do we limit mastery to being able to expertly tackle masterworks of the common practice period, or ought we include Bartok, Boulez, Messiaen? Does mastery of piano imply corresponding mastery of theory, history, sight-reading, transposition, improvisation, collaborative music, and teaching? Or will a -Liebestraum- that doesn't end in a complete breakdown get you over the line? It depends on context--which makes Gladwell's decontextualized figure both functionally useless and pedagogically dangerous, at least for music.
Personally, I feel that quality practice is not a necessary evil or a means to an end. Quality practice -is- the end goal; being able to concertize convincingly, at any level, is just one of many happy side-effects. A mechanical approach is the antithesis of music-making. You can clock all the hours you want, but if your daily practice doesn't make you happy, it will be apparent in every note you play in concert (again, at any level). So don't calculate your hours, calculate how happy you are making music. In that way, music can do its job of healing the world. :)
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Great analysis, as always. 10,000 hours is far too low an estimate for piano. Let's say you do an undergrad professional degree in piano performance, practicing 4 quality hours every day for 4 years. That's 5,840 hrs. Then you do an M.M., practicing 6 hrs/day for 2 years. That's 4,380 hrs. Total = 10,220 hours over 6 years. HOWEVER ...
Even to turn in a decent audition for an undergrad program requires a threshold of mastery of both repertoire and technical. For example, if you begin lessons at age 6, 12 years of 2 hrs/day practice -on average- (less time when younger, more when older) is not unusual. In my experience, people with natural talent tend to practice more, not less, so there's probably no shortcut there, at least in terms of hours. So that's a baseline of 8,760 hrs before you even get to undergrad, for a grand total of 18,980 hrs over 18 years--nearly twice Gladwell's figure.
Another issue is that advanced piano repertoire and technical is physically demanding. Nobody just sits down and starts practicing for 2 or 4 or 6 hours a day unless they are determined to injure themselves. You have to develop intelligent and non-injurious practice habits, ramp up to these -serious- amounts of practice, find a -cruising altitude- to carry you forward--and then, never stop. It's also helpful to have a teacher who is not a complete lunatic. In short, there are so many variables unique to each individual and situation that it's difficult to see how Gladwell's figure has any meaningful relevance to music practice. (Or anything else, for that matter.)
A flaw of Gladwell's hypothesis is that by selecting a subset of a discipline's elements, it's possible to curve-fit any discipline to 10,000 hours of practice and call that -mastery-. My rough estimates above use the M.M. as an arbitrary metric; but as more and more schools offer a D.M.A., will that become the new standard of mastery? Is mastery therefore subject to inflation? Do we limit mastery to being able to expertly tackle masterworks of the common practice period, or ought we include Bartok, Boulez, Messiaen? Does mastery of piano imply corresponding mastery of theory, history, sight-reading, transposition, improvisation, collaborative music, and teaching? Or will a -Liebestraum- that doesn't end in a complete breakdown get you over the line? It depends on context--which makes Gladwell's decontextualized figure both functionally useless and pedagogically dangerous, at least for music.
Personally, I feel that quality practice is not a necessary evil or a means to an end. Quality practice -is- the end goal; being able to concertize convincingly, at any level, is just one of many happy side-effects. A mechanical approach is the antithesis of music-making. You can clock all the hours you want, but if your daily practice doesn't make you happy, it will be apparent in every note you play in concert (again, at any level). So don't calculate your hours, calculate how happy you are making music. In that way, music can do its job of healing the world. :)
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Will
Great video again Gareth touching on some very interesting points. Whilst I would love to be able to play like a professional, I think that someone like myself, (overflowing with enthusiasm but no natural talent) we have to accept something a little less. I've spent about 6 years becoming somewhere between late beginner and early intermediate but pushing as hard as i can to go beyond that. It's never going to happen. I did spend a year going to a piano teacher but that didn't help either. There seemed to be no stucture to the teaching, just a different piece to learn each time and asking questions about why I was learning a particular piece did not result in a clear answer. e.g. -How does learnng a scale help with learning to play songs? Songs don't normally have that kind of scale structure.- Answer: -I don't know but it seems to work-.
Anyway what I do now is, spend part of the time enjoying playing the simple tunes that my skill level will allow and the rest following tutorial books. Accepting this lesser aim has taken away some of the stress of trying to play like the professionals.
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Great video again Gareth touching on some very interesting points. Whilst I would love to be able to play like a professional, I think that someone like myself, (overflowing with enthusiasm but no natural talent) we have to accept something a little less. I've spent about 6 years becoming somewhere between late beginner and early intermediate but pushing as hard as i can to go beyond that. It's never going to happen. I did spend a year going to a piano teacher but that didn't help either. There seemed to be no stucture to the teaching, just a different piece to learn each time and asking questions about why I was learning a particular piece did not result in a clear answer. e.g. -How does learnng a scale help with learning to play songs? Songs don't normally have that kind of scale structure.- Answer: -I don't know but it seems to work-.
Anyway what I do now is, spend part of the time enjoying playing the simple tunes that my skill level will allow and the rest following tutorial books. Accepting this lesser aim has taken away some of the stress of trying to play like the professionals.
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John
I'm a bit conflicted about what you say here, You quite rightly say that you don't -need- natural talent, but then shortly after you say if you want to do Music professionally you must require not only natural talent, but significant amounts of it, then follow this by saying you don't want to put anyone off. But that's exactly what will happen with a statement like this, I'm hoping to turn music into my Career, I'm 18 and I practice -30% of days for 30 mins to an hour. I'm fully, fully aware this is critically low (It's been this bad for the 4 years I've been playing piano).
I've always struggled deeply with practice, It's gotten quite nasty sometimes. I still do struggle with practice, I didn't practice again today for instance. But I won't let this thwart my aspirations to do music professionally.
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I'm a bit conflicted about what you say here, You quite rightly say that you don't -need- natural talent, but then shortly after you say if you want to do Music professionally you must require not only natural talent, but significant amounts of it, then follow this by saying you don't want to put anyone off. But that's exactly what will happen with a statement like this, I'm hoping to turn music into my Career, I'm 18 and I practice -30% of days for 30 mins to an hour. I'm fully, fully aware this is critically low (It's been this bad for the 4 years I've been playing piano).
I've always struggled deeply with practice, It's gotten quite nasty sometimes. I still do struggle with practice, I didn't practice again today for instance. But I won't let this thwart my aspirations to do music professionally.
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Monica
When i was a teenager I had 10 years lessons and basically never studied , this is my terrible regret. But 7 years I took piano again and studying every day an hour and in the last year two hours per day, I saw a huge difference, due also to the fact that in my teenage years I only knew a bit of solfege but I had no idea about music theory, whereas 10 years ago I started a musicology course at University for three years and this really helps me. I think now that I have around 5000 hours practice altogether, counting all my years, so in another 5 years probably I will reach my 10000. I am 53, but I promised to my self to become a decent piano player for my enjoyment before I die. I hope to make it. By the way I do not think I have any natural talent-
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When i was a teenager I had 10 years lessons and basically never studied , this is my terrible regret. But 7 years I took piano again and studying every day an hour and in the last year two hours per day, I saw a huge difference, due also to the fact that in my teenage years I only knew a bit of solfege but I had no idea about music theory, whereas 10 years ago I started a musicology course at University for three years and this really helps me. I think now that I have around 5000 hours practice altogether, counting all my years, so in another 5 years probably I will reach my 10000. I am 53, but I promised to my self to become a decent piano player for my enjoyment before I die. I hope to make it. By the way I do not think I have any natural talent-
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thepianoplayer416
Other ideas that came to mind include how far you push yourself on learning new materials and how much time you spend in a given day. Suppose you are learning a new language, going through the same phrases -Hello- & -Good Bye- in a foreign language for weeks would take you years to master it. You can't treat time as a linear unit of measurement. With a lot of exposure to a language each day, you're going to get to the conversation level in months. Otherwise you may not get to a comfortable level to participate in a conversation. Playing piano 4h/day with breaks in between in the long run is going to get you to an advanced level much sooner than 10,000h /4.
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Other ideas that came to mind include how far you push yourself on learning new materials and how much time you spend in a given day. Suppose you are learning a new language, going through the same phrases -Hello- & -Good Bye- in a foreign language for weeks would take you years to master it. You can't treat time as a linear unit of measurement. With a lot of exposure to a language each day, you're going to get to the conversation level in months. Otherwise you may not get to a comfortable level to participate in a conversation. Playing piano 4h/day with breaks in between in the long run is going to get you to an advanced level much sooner than 10,000h /4.
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Impromptu
A high level of competence, even brilliance, takes years of hard work but you could spend a lifetime and never master it. One of the things that's irked me over the years is people assuming I can play Hammond, synths, etc just because they're -keyboard instruments-. I'm nice about it though. I won't take a gig and have a go but I'll recommend someone who's really into it. If I were granted four lives maybe I could say I'd -mastered- the piano at the end of that. Incidentally, the best pianists I know are exceptional sightreaders with ears like bats (not perfect pitch, they just breathe theory), so it isn't just about technique.
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A high level of competence, even brilliance, takes years of hard work but you could spend a lifetime and never master it. One of the things that's irked me over the years is people assuming I can play Hammond, synths, etc just because they're -keyboard instruments-. I'm nice about it though. I won't take a gig and have a go but I'll recommend someone who's really into it. If I were granted four lives maybe I could say I'd -mastered- the piano at the end of that. Incidentally, the best pianists I know are exceptional sightreaders with ears like bats (not perfect pitch, they just breathe theory), so it isn't just about technique.
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gopi
Great lesson as Always.. Sir..
Sir, I have a query about extensions.. Do we add extensions from same key or parallel key??..
Is my interpretation correct Sir?
In C-major scale,
For C chord, Dm chord notes will be extensions D F A.. 9 11 13 respectively
For Dm chord, Em chord notes will be extns 9,11,13..E, G, B..
For Em chord... F chord notes will be 9 11 and 13
For F chord... G chord notes will be extns
For G chord.. Am chord notes will be extns..
For Am chord.. B diminished chord notes will be extns... right Sir?????
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Great lesson as Always.. Sir..
Sir, I have a query about extensions.. Do we add extensions from same key or parallel key??..
Is my interpretation correct Sir?
In C-major scale,
For C chord, Dm chord notes will be extensions D F A.. 9 11 13 respectively
For Dm chord, Em chord notes will be extns 9,11,13..E, G, B..
For Em chord... F chord notes will be 9 11 and 13
For F chord... G chord notes will be extns
For G chord.. Am chord notes will be extns..
For Am chord.. B diminished chord notes will be extns... right Sir?????
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Selena
In my country we have an accomplished composer. I won't say his name. Ever since he was a kid, his mother hired a piano teacher. He had no performance. One day at the age of 18 he was under a tree, his friend who was on the tree fell on his head. Since then he started playing perfectly and composing. He visits London very often because it inspires him to write music. The story is true. -
There are scientists who say knowledge is a memory. That little bit about talent.
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In my country we have an accomplished composer. I won't say his name. Ever since he was a kid, his mother hired a piano teacher. He had no performance. One day at the age of 18 he was under a tree, his friend who was on the tree fell on his head. Since then he started playing perfectly and composing. He visits London very often because it inspires him to write music. The story is true. -
There are scientists who say knowledge is a memory. That little bit about talent.
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Lynkevmusic
a good teacher is so important. I practised on my own for a long time and though I passed grade 8 with just a handful of lessons, some of the basic fundamentals of piano were lost to me.
this affected my technique going forward. It's only now after 8 months of having a really good teacher that I can see the benefits. Online tuition and aps may help you with playing a song but to truly play well and have a solid foundation, a teacher is necessary.
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a good teacher is so important. I practised on my own for a long time and though I passed grade 8 with just a handful of lessons, some of the basic fundamentals of piano were lost to me.
this affected my technique going forward. It's only now after 8 months of having a really good teacher that I can see the benefits. Online tuition and aps may help you with playing a song but to truly play well and have a solid foundation, a teacher is necessary.
reply
Lawrence
P.S. I think this topic is amazing. Really the key is to get yourself in the mindset of pursuing the craft joyfully, even if it means failing disasterously. If you aren't enjoying it, you aren't being creative on the thing and you aren't progressing in any way, nor will you achieve those 10,000 hours. I think that the point is to have done it without even realizing you did because you simply love to do it.
Do you guys still sell t-shirts?
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P.S. I think this topic is amazing. Really the key is to get yourself in the mindset of pursuing the craft joyfully, even if it means failing disasterously. If you aren't enjoying it, you aren't being creative on the thing and you aren't progressing in any way, nor will you achieve those 10,000 hours. I think that the point is to have done it without even realizing you did because you simply love to do it.
Do you guys still sell t-shirts?
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