What If the Universe Is Conscious?
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Date: 2023-11-26
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Comments and reviews: 30
TheLithp
I think there's an elephant in the room that needs addressed: You compared the arrangement of both galaxies & neurons to webs, so are all webs also conscious? When you dust away a spiderweb, are you committing murder? Is net-fishing slavery? Things having similar patterns doesn't really imply they have similar properties. Neurons are biochemical cells that transmit electrical signals to each other while the galactic web is thought to be a result of the arrangement of dark matter. So, how would they even transmit thought? Gravitational waves? Shouldn't we be able to see that pattern & read it like an EEG machine? It seems that would be implied by the assumption that they're working similarly to each other.
What do you mean not too far off? You said there were 31 billion more galaxies than neurons. Compared to 69 billion neurons, that's an increase of nearly 50%. Not that I'm sure why that figure matters, since different organisms would have different numbers of neurons. The fruit fly, for instance, has 2500 neurons in its brain. More doesn't necessarily indicate greater intelligence, either, since killer whales are estimated to have double the number of neurons humans have. According to some estimates, anyway, there are so many different ways of counting them that it's essentially meaningless. Which is just as well because I don't want to get any more sidetracked than I already am. The point is that -they both have really high numbers- doesn't mean anything.
So, it's a good thing there's more, but the only thing that seemed specific enough was the universe having an average of 4 connections. Again, I don't see what the point is since it was already different from the neuronal connection average. How are we defining -similar enough- to make the connection, like what scientific measurement is that? Well, whatever, it's worth explaining anyway.
I'm no cosmologist, but I know that gravity acts equally in all directions, so it would make a lot of sense if this was the most stable structure gravity formed, with the bridges forming equidistant from each other & the places between them getting cleared out as that material is absorbed by galactic clusters. That's actually similar to the process that forms the molecular pattern of ice (albeit using hydrogen bonding instead of gravity, & wouldn't you know it, each water molecule makes connections with 4 others under ideal conditions.
Pretty much the first thing I agreed with is that the universe would have to understand its position in space & time, which is a massive problem since it IS space & time, & that space & time varies in different parts of the universe. Einstein's theory of relativity, remember? Moreover, due to the expansion of the universe, it would have to exchange information faster than light, which is a no go in physics.
You ask if it could be conscious on a level we don't understand, but then what's the point of the cosmic web if we're ultimately going to say it doesn't matter because the universe could be conscious through some, no offense, but essentially magical, undetectable means? Anything could be conscious by that metric. A rock could be conscious because it exchanges intangible astral waves with other rocks. Does that seem plausible simply because we don't know everything about consciousness? I don't think so. We know enough to be able to recognize it, or at least its absence. We can tell when a person is unconscious & even test AI to see if they demonstrate it.
Come on, man, if -consciousness is when systems relate to each other & work together, - then the water cycle is conscious, plate tectonics is conscious, the solar system is conscious, your school group project is conscious. yeah, I didn't want to say it before, but you're right, I am totally thinking you went off the rails with this one. None of this actually makes sense, it's just listing off big numbers, as well as vague things that sort of look like coincidences if you squint, & then going -What if consciousness? - Look, it's totally fair to explore off-the-wall questions, but -what if systems ARE consciousness- is really the point at which you should have taken a step back & asked yourself if your train of thought got derailed somewhere.
No. I'm just going to answer the question. No, it isn't. Consciousness doesn't just require complex webs of interconnected objects, they also have to exchange information in a specific way. Ice, spider webs, & school projects are not conscious, nor is the universe. Due to the way light works, we can see the behavior of galaxies across the ages, so we would be able to see if such a pattern of information exchange was somehow occurring. But we don't, & it isn't because we're too insignificant to understand it. Most of what we see IS things that we don't understand--dark matter & dark energy--but they exhibit uniform behavior, which is far from what conscious signals would imply. If all of the neurons in your brain fired in the same rhythm, do you know what that would be? A seizure. Which, given the out-of-control nature of its expansion without any evident goal, just might fit. The universe has more in common with epilepsy than consciousness. But that's just an analogy: The point remains that patterns emerge from natural, unthinking forces all of the time.
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I think there's an elephant in the room that needs addressed: You compared the arrangement of both galaxies & neurons to webs, so are all webs also conscious? When you dust away a spiderweb, are you committing murder? Is net-fishing slavery? Things having similar patterns doesn't really imply they have similar properties. Neurons are biochemical cells that transmit electrical signals to each other while the galactic web is thought to be a result of the arrangement of dark matter. So, how would they even transmit thought? Gravitational waves? Shouldn't we be able to see that pattern & read it like an EEG machine? It seems that would be implied by the assumption that they're working similarly to each other.
What do you mean not too far off? You said there were 31 billion more galaxies than neurons. Compared to 69 billion neurons, that's an increase of nearly 50%. Not that I'm sure why that figure matters, since different organisms would have different numbers of neurons. The fruit fly, for instance, has 2500 neurons in its brain. More doesn't necessarily indicate greater intelligence, either, since killer whales are estimated to have double the number of neurons humans have. According to some estimates, anyway, there are so many different ways of counting them that it's essentially meaningless. Which is just as well because I don't want to get any more sidetracked than I already am. The point is that -they both have really high numbers- doesn't mean anything.
So, it's a good thing there's more, but the only thing that seemed specific enough was the universe having an average of 4 connections. Again, I don't see what the point is since it was already different from the neuronal connection average. How are we defining -similar enough- to make the connection, like what scientific measurement is that? Well, whatever, it's worth explaining anyway.
I'm no cosmologist, but I know that gravity acts equally in all directions, so it would make a lot of sense if this was the most stable structure gravity formed, with the bridges forming equidistant from each other & the places between them getting cleared out as that material is absorbed by galactic clusters. That's actually similar to the process that forms the molecular pattern of ice (albeit using hydrogen bonding instead of gravity, & wouldn't you know it, each water molecule makes connections with 4 others under ideal conditions.
Pretty much the first thing I agreed with is that the universe would have to understand its position in space & time, which is a massive problem since it IS space & time, & that space & time varies in different parts of the universe. Einstein's theory of relativity, remember? Moreover, due to the expansion of the universe, it would have to exchange information faster than light, which is a no go in physics.
You ask if it could be conscious on a level we don't understand, but then what's the point of the cosmic web if we're ultimately going to say it doesn't matter because the universe could be conscious through some, no offense, but essentially magical, undetectable means? Anything could be conscious by that metric. A rock could be conscious because it exchanges intangible astral waves with other rocks. Does that seem plausible simply because we don't know everything about consciousness? I don't think so. We know enough to be able to recognize it, or at least its absence. We can tell when a person is unconscious & even test AI to see if they demonstrate it.
Come on, man, if -consciousness is when systems relate to each other & work together, - then the water cycle is conscious, plate tectonics is conscious, the solar system is conscious, your school group project is conscious. yeah, I didn't want to say it before, but you're right, I am totally thinking you went off the rails with this one. None of this actually makes sense, it's just listing off big numbers, as well as vague things that sort of look like coincidences if you squint, & then going -What if consciousness? - Look, it's totally fair to explore off-the-wall questions, but -what if systems ARE consciousness- is really the point at which you should have taken a step back & asked yourself if your train of thought got derailed somewhere.
No. I'm just going to answer the question. No, it isn't. Consciousness doesn't just require complex webs of interconnected objects, they also have to exchange information in a specific way. Ice, spider webs, & school projects are not conscious, nor is the universe. Due to the way light works, we can see the behavior of galaxies across the ages, so we would be able to see if such a pattern of information exchange was somehow occurring. But we don't, & it isn't because we're too insignificant to understand it. Most of what we see IS things that we don't understand--dark matter & dark energy--but they exhibit uniform behavior, which is far from what conscious signals would imply. If all of the neurons in your brain fired in the same rhythm, do you know what that would be? A seizure. Which, given the out-of-control nature of its expansion without any evident goal, just might fit. The universe has more in common with epilepsy than consciousness. But that's just an analogy: The point remains that patterns emerge from natural, unthinking forces all of the time.
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Lehcar
As humans, we know we are conscious because we experience and feel things. But we are still unable to explain exactly what consciousness is or where it comes from.
-Consciousness - or better, conscious experience - is obviously a part of reality, - Johannes Kleiner, a mathematician and theoretical physicist at the Munich Center For Mathematical Philosophy, Germany, shared in an interview. -We're all having it but without understanding how it relates to the known physics, our understanding of the universe is incomplete. -
With that in mind, Kleiner is hoping math will enable him to precisely define consciousness. Working with colleague Sean Tull, a mathematician at the University of Oxford, U. K, the pair are being driven, to some degree, by a philosophical point of view called panpsychism.
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As humans, we know we are conscious because we experience and feel things. But we are still unable to explain exactly what consciousness is or where it comes from.
-Consciousness - or better, conscious experience - is obviously a part of reality, - Johannes Kleiner, a mathematician and theoretical physicist at the Munich Center For Mathematical Philosophy, Germany, shared in an interview. -We're all having it but without understanding how it relates to the known physics, our understanding of the universe is incomplete. -
With that in mind, Kleiner is hoping math will enable him to precisely define consciousness. Working with colleague Sean Tull, a mathematician at the University of Oxford, U. K, the pair are being driven, to some degree, by a philosophical point of view called panpsychism.
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CPizzle
The Universe is conscious and it-s been way before we showed up. The only sure thing science can prove today, is, WE DONT KNOW SQUAT! There is a power behind space and time that we can-t even begin to imagine. Pure energy that can never dissipate, die or be destroyed and we-ve proven that light energy can transport and store information. The smartest physicist and quantum physicist now look at each other with bug eyes saying, -ummmmm! --
The Universe is too perfect. Our own solar system doesn-t make sense. Our Moon! -
It shouldn-t be there but it is and plays critical roles in life on Earth. This isn-t even reality. It-s FAKE AF! But never jump on science like they have it all figured out because the Webb telescope has already shot down so many theories and is turning science on its head.
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The Universe is conscious and it-s been way before we showed up. The only sure thing science can prove today, is, WE DONT KNOW SQUAT! There is a power behind space and time that we can-t even begin to imagine. Pure energy that can never dissipate, die or be destroyed and we-ve proven that light energy can transport and store information. The smartest physicist and quantum physicist now look at each other with bug eyes saying, -ummmmm! --
The Universe is too perfect. Our own solar system doesn-t make sense. Our Moon! -
It shouldn-t be there but it is and plays critical roles in life on Earth. This isn-t even reality. It-s FAKE AF! But never jump on science like they have it all figured out because the Webb telescope has already shot down so many theories and is turning science on its head.
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20
This is not crazy at all. Matter of fact, I have thought this same theory for a long time. I believe that we are so very tiny. I would equate humans to ants on one ant hill on the planet. The ants do not have the intelligence to know what is out there. We are the same way. We do not have the intelligence to know what we are a part of. I believe that the universe is way bigger than any of the scientists think. If we were able to pan out on our world, you would find that we are just one atom in a very, very, very large object, and who knows what that object is.
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This is not crazy at all. Matter of fact, I have thought this same theory for a long time. I believe that we are so very tiny. I would equate humans to ants on one ant hill on the planet. The ants do not have the intelligence to know what is out there. We are the same way. We do not have the intelligence to know what we are a part of. I believe that the universe is way bigger than any of the scientists think. If we were able to pan out on our world, you would find that we are just one atom in a very, very, very large object, and who knows what that object is.
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Cat
I think we'd have to forget about the 186, 000 mi/sec speed limit that we currently believe cannot be exceeded, or this cosmic brain would be the SLOWEST thinking brain imaginable. But considering it has all the time it needs, maybe there IS some incredibly powerful, but mind-blowingly SLOW thinking that's going on out there (or all around us. Please don't reply that this must -therefore- be God, because that's an oversimplified -concept- from an earlier age in human intellectual development that won't accept inspection for validity. Can't really trust it.
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I think we'd have to forget about the 186, 000 mi/sec speed limit that we currently believe cannot be exceeded, or this cosmic brain would be the SLOWEST thinking brain imaginable. But considering it has all the time it needs, maybe there IS some incredibly powerful, but mind-blowingly SLOW thinking that's going on out there (or all around us. Please don't reply that this must -therefore- be God, because that's an oversimplified -concept- from an earlier age in human intellectual development that won't accept inspection for validity. Can't really trust it.
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Dannyx
Just like your dreams are different versions of yourself, you might be one neuron in your brain, the actual multiverse. Who you are is determined by which part of the brain your located, if you're romantic you're a single neuron in the right hemisphere of the brain, if you're social maybe you're in the left hemisphere, successful in career you're a variation in a deeper part of the that side. We're all just thoughts of a conscious being
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Just like your dreams are different versions of yourself, you might be one neuron in your brain, the actual multiverse. Who you are is determined by which part of the brain your located, if you're romantic you're a single neuron in the right hemisphere of the brain, if you're social maybe you're in the left hemisphere, successful in career you're a variation in a deeper part of the that side. We're all just thoughts of a conscious being
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raferrerorocher
i dont think universe is a giant brain, but its not just the universe and human brain that are similar in terms of structure and working but many other things are similar too. planets revolve around stars just like electrons revolving around a nucleus. These similarities are some sort of easter eggs or proofs that the creator of the universe left for us to observe and know that this universe was made by just one creator.
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i dont think universe is a giant brain, but its not just the universe and human brain that are similar in terms of structure and working but many other things are similar too. planets revolve around stars just like electrons revolving around a nucleus. These similarities are some sort of easter eggs or proofs that the creator of the universe left for us to observe and know that this universe was made by just one creator.
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Box
A punk kid of sentient energy of -. That builds blocks stacking one on another, just to knock it all down. And do it again. Only we are the blocks. And it is a virus. spreading across the universe. Be4 the sun goes nova. Or just for amusement watch as we burn up trying. - and is being done on other planets. Maybe seperate giia's boltzman brains, maybe just one' controling all. Like a octupus. Having 8 brains all controled by one.
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A punk kid of sentient energy of -. That builds blocks stacking one on another, just to knock it all down. And do it again. Only we are the blocks. And it is a virus. spreading across the universe. Be4 the sun goes nova. Or just for amusement watch as we burn up trying. - and is being done on other planets. Maybe seperate giia's boltzman brains, maybe just one' controling all. Like a octupus. Having 8 brains all controled by one.
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Bethra
This is assuming that consciousness is in the brain. Som Scientists and specifically Quantum Physicists are realizing that the brain is more like a transmitter and receiver in its operations not the origination of thoughts and feelings ('consciousness'. So if the universe is just the receiver/ transmitter of information or 'truth', who or what is the originator? Something to think about hay?
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This is assuming that consciousness is in the brain. Som Scientists and specifically Quantum Physicists are realizing that the brain is more like a transmitter and receiver in its operations not the origination of thoughts and feelings ('consciousness'. So if the universe is just the receiver/ transmitter of information or 'truth', who or what is the originator? Something to think about hay?
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Jhon
What if the galaxy we know is one small or big part of one living celestial being or we can call living creature that have consciousness, and we are small part of him/her like good and bad bacterias or mini organism that living with him/her part. And we didn't know that there's a lot of celestial like the living galaxy theory we have.
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What if the galaxy we know is one small or big part of one living celestial being or we can call living creature that have consciousness, and we are small part of him/her like good and bad bacterias or mini organism that living with him/her part. And we didn't know that there's a lot of celestial like the living galaxy theory we have.
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Nigtamare_Luna-
Hey that was mind blowing but what if dreams are the portal of paraler universe, re even more what if this galaxy and stuff is just a dream and when we go to sleep, what are we are dreaming about is real in reality? i have so so sooo many questions. but i don't want to blow my and your brain too -by thinking too much. --
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Hey that was mind blowing but what if dreams are the portal of paraler universe, re even more what if this galaxy and stuff is just a dream and when we go to sleep, what are we are dreaming about is real in reality? i have so so sooo many questions. but i don't want to blow my and your brain too -by thinking too much. --
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Matt
It could be completely wrong, we don't know as of yet but it's making sense weirdly enough. I think we are skimping information to make stuff make sense, but it doesn't always make sense. Humans want to know everything before our time is up, but I don't think we will know anywhere near as much as we think we know
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It could be completely wrong, we don't know as of yet but it's making sense weirdly enough. I think we are skimping information to make stuff make sense, but it doesn't always make sense. Humans want to know everything before our time is up, but I don't think we will know anywhere near as much as we think we know
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sam
I like the idea that technically we are the universe's manifestation of conscience. After all we are made of what the universe is made, molecules, atoms etc.
Yes we are -humans-, but in the end, everything is made up of the same things.
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I like the idea that technically we are the universe's manifestation of conscience. After all we are made of what the universe is made, molecules, atoms etc.
Yes we are -humans-, but in the end, everything is made up of the same things.
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Adam
The galaxies could simply communicate through the information that light can carry.
Even if it took several thousand light years to convey that data, it would be no time at all when comparing the life and overall size of the universe.
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The galaxies could simply communicate through the information that light can carry.
Even if it took several thousand light years to convey that data, it would be no time at all when comparing the life and overall size of the universe.
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Horsepower
Imagine if our brains were universes of their own & dementia is basically the heat death of those universes. Perhaps, time in those universes is faster than in our own universes, with millions of years passing in several minutes.
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Imagine if our brains were universes of their own & dementia is basically the heat death of those universes. Perhaps, time in those universes is faster than in our own universes, with millions of years passing in several minutes.
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Arbee
This is my own thoughts explained to my friend 10-12 yrs ago - after reading our ancient Hindu Vedic scriptures.
-Maybe we are the part of a living person that is our Maha Vishnu or the Garvodakshaya Vishnu-
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This is my own thoughts explained to my friend 10-12 yrs ago - after reading our ancient Hindu Vedic scriptures.
-Maybe we are the part of a living person that is our Maha Vishnu or the Garvodakshaya Vishnu-
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Jordan
There are more universes, there are billions of aliens and We are tiny insects living in an aliens brain, and in all of our brains is more people and inside their brain is even more and it keeps going
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There are more universes, there are billions of aliens and We are tiny insects living in an aliens brain, and in all of our brains is more people and inside their brain is even more and it keeps going
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Kenneth
We are inside of a brain of a living being 1 year for that being is 1 billion year in our universe if our universe is 30 billion galactic years then the being outside is 30 years old in his realm
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We are inside of a brain of a living being 1 year for that being is 1 billion year in our universe if our universe is 30 billion galactic years then the being outside is 30 years old in his realm
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ServantofYah
This fits into my theory about the universe being a representation of the human mind. That being, full of darkness and imaginations and yet people have the nerve to call it 'god'.
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This fits into my theory about the universe being a representation of the human mind. That being, full of darkness and imaginations and yet people have the nerve to call it 'god'.
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Nicole
The Universe is spiritually conscious, DUHHHHHHHHHHHH. ACT LIKE YOU KNOW. BECAUSE NOT KNOWING OR HAVING THAT VITAL IMPORTANT INFORMATION CAN CAUSE APOCALYPTIC EVENTS TO OCCUR.
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The Universe is spiritually conscious, DUHHHHHHHHHHHH. ACT LIKE YOU KNOW. BECAUSE NOT KNOWING OR HAVING THAT VITAL IMPORTANT INFORMATION CAN CAUSE APOCALYPTIC EVENTS TO OCCUR.
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Tiffany
What if it isn-t a separate brain, but it is ours? We are somehow looking into our -brain- when looking into the cosmos. All the so called empty space is possibility.
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What if it isn-t a separate brain, but it is ours? We are somehow looking into our -brain- when looking into the cosmos. All the so called empty space is possibility.
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jjason
How Does it not? It's made of the same material that our brain is. Can you think - right now with out this -network -? Why -? Would the -universe- be any different?
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How Does it not? It's made of the same material that our brain is. Can you think - right now with out this -network -? Why -? Would the -universe- be any different?
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Yapap1234567
-is the universe conscious- but isnt it tho? we are created from the universe, we are the universe, we are conscious. conscious universe right there, boys
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-is the universe conscious- but isnt it tho? we are created from the universe, we are the universe, we are conscious. conscious universe right there, boys
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JIMMY
Sometimes i wonder that when we sleep we build up our DMT instead of using it to dream. So when we wake up we have enough DMT to hallucinate our reality.
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Sometimes i wonder that when we sleep we build up our DMT instead of using it to dream. So when we wake up we have enough DMT to hallucinate our reality.
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Grace
gausa jauh2 luar angkasa, tubuh manusia aja blm spnuhnya kt mengerti-
jgnjgn slama ini kt bag dr otak makhluk yg kt sbut univers tsb. Mindblownnn
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gausa jauh2 luar angkasa, tubuh manusia aja blm spnuhnya kt mengerti-
jgnjgn slama ini kt bag dr otak makhluk yg kt sbut univers tsb. Mindblownnn
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Brandon
Could your brain be a mini version of the cosmos - as above so below - what or who created our brain? we sure didn-t - mysteries of our existence
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Could your brain be a mini version of the cosmos - as above so below - what or who created our brain? we sure didn-t - mysteries of our existence
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Truck-kun
This theory cause same paradox as simulation theory.
If universe is a brain then the -body- of universe inside another universe
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This theory cause same paradox as simulation theory.
If universe is a brain then the -body- of universe inside another universe
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Lerajj
We'll i hope the brain that we are in doesn't die and if it did it would probably be 1 billion time delay for us
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We'll i hope the brain that we are in doesn't die and if it did it would probably be 1 billion time delay for us
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DJ
If we have consciousness, then the universe has, everything we have the universe has, we're part of the same thing
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If we have consciousness, then the universe has, everything we have the universe has, we're part of the same thing
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Endrit
the fact that solar systems and atoms have the similar structure it's really crazy how little we understand
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the fact that solar systems and atoms have the similar structure it's really crazy how little we understand
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