We Found Problems: AMD Ryzen 5 8600G & R7 8700G APU Benchmarks & Review
video description
Date: 2024-01-30
Related videos
Comments and reviews: 20
RurouTube
My take on these 8600G and 8700G reviews is that 8700G is more bandwidth limited than 8600G. The difference in compute performance, which I believe 8700G probably have 60% more FLOPS vs 8600G but only 20% faster in gaming at best. So honestly, budget gamer that want to use APU for gaming should just buy 8600G instead of 8700G, It is 30% cheaper for at most 20% slower performance in gaming.
This is honestly my main problem with APU. People saying that they wanted bigger APU. Some even confused on why AMD doesn't have an APU with the same amount of CU as PS5 APU. The answer is not just because they don't think there is a market for it, but also from technical standpoint, it is a waste of transistor to do that. On a specific application where it can hammers the CU without using much memory bandwidth, yes, you can see the benefit. For typical use case (in this case, most probably want it for gaming), it will just be a disappointment. On a laptop, high CU count APU can still make sense by using it as a way to lower the clock while still having good enough performance, thus you probably would end up with a more efficient APU. And yes, running the GPU portion at 2900MHz is definitely way above the sweet spot.
Because of that, the question would be if you have a $230 budget for CPU GPU, should you buy a 8600G or a cheap CPU with a cheap GPU 12100F cost $100. thus you now only have $130 for GPU and at that price instead of 6500XT, your option is 6400. All of this with the assumption that you want to buy everything new of course. The question of course is how 8600G would fare compared to 12100F RX 6400 I hope reviewers would at least test that combo instead of trying to do this instead of focusing too much on 8700G price point.
reply
My take on these 8600G and 8700G reviews is that 8700G is more bandwidth limited than 8600G. The difference in compute performance, which I believe 8700G probably have 60% more FLOPS vs 8600G but only 20% faster in gaming at best. So honestly, budget gamer that want to use APU for gaming should just buy 8600G instead of 8700G, It is 30% cheaper for at most 20% slower performance in gaming.
This is honestly my main problem with APU. People saying that they wanted bigger APU. Some even confused on why AMD doesn't have an APU with the same amount of CU as PS5 APU. The answer is not just because they don't think there is a market for it, but also from technical standpoint, it is a waste of transistor to do that. On a specific application where it can hammers the CU without using much memory bandwidth, yes, you can see the benefit. For typical use case (in this case, most probably want it for gaming), it will just be a disappointment. On a laptop, high CU count APU can still make sense by using it as a way to lower the clock while still having good enough performance, thus you probably would end up with a more efficient APU. And yes, running the GPU portion at 2900MHz is definitely way above the sweet spot.
Because of that, the question would be if you have a $230 budget for CPU GPU, should you buy a 8600G or a cheap CPU with a cheap GPU 12100F cost $100. thus you now only have $130 for GPU and at that price instead of 6500XT, your option is 6400. All of this with the assumption that you want to buy everything new of course. The question of course is how 8600G would fare compared to 12100F RX 6400 I hope reviewers would at least test that combo instead of trying to do this instead of focusing too much on 8700G price point.
reply
TheJoascrack
The best case solution, that you didn't mention, is to enterprises, because that when I invest on computer parts I want the best processor possible but I also need some kind of gfx, and if that is capable of give some speed to some of the software that I use, then that is great!
Usually I bought the best CPU possible in my budget (lately I've been buying the x700 Ryzen 7 non X version) and pair with with a very cheat Nvidia 710 ou 720). Now, and since 5700G, I'm buying it because it really a better option for my company.
I need a processor that can hold for 5-7 Years, and this year I'm gonna retire the 1700 that I bought and still doing a fine job, despite the age, and before with the Intel parts, specially the I5 ones with the IGPU, that had always big performance issues, at the end of the life cycle at my company.
So this APU will be great to it, though I want to try the difference between then and the 7700, in my company specificly usecase, since I rather have CPU performance in 5-7 years from now that I have IGPU.
reply
The best case solution, that you didn't mention, is to enterprises, because that when I invest on computer parts I want the best processor possible but I also need some kind of gfx, and if that is capable of give some speed to some of the software that I use, then that is great!
Usually I bought the best CPU possible in my budget (lately I've been buying the x700 Ryzen 7 non X version) and pair with with a very cheat Nvidia 710 ou 720). Now, and since 5700G, I'm buying it because it really a better option for my company.
I need a processor that can hold for 5-7 Years, and this year I'm gonna retire the 1700 that I bought and still doing a fine job, despite the age, and before with the Intel parts, specially the I5 ones with the IGPU, that had always big performance issues, at the end of the life cycle at my company.
So this APU will be great to it, though I want to try the difference between then and the 7700, in my company specificly usecase, since I rather have CPU performance in 5-7 years from now that I have IGPU.
reply
radugrigoras
Seems kind of pointless, this would be more for a new build, so you need all the components. If it was me and I wanted something really small I would buy a laptop on eBay with a dead screen or battery, take out the mobo, 3D print a case (doesn’t only work on framework laptops guys) and I’d be off to the races. Can probably get yourself an i7 and a 2080 for the same price. I’m actually thinking of doing that with my old work laptop, it has 10980 and Quadro 5000 32gb of ram and 2 m.2 slots. I can get a m.2 to Sata card and make myself a really nice little server out of it. My battery is still decent so i would have ups too. 2080 laptop = 2060 desktop with more memory, 3080 = 3060, 3080ti = 3070, 4090 = 4070. So you can get some great deals out there if you’re willing to dismantle the laptop, are comfortable using measurement tools, cad, and 3d printing.
reply
Seems kind of pointless, this would be more for a new build, so you need all the components. If it was me and I wanted something really small I would buy a laptop on eBay with a dead screen or battery, take out the mobo, 3D print a case (doesn’t only work on framework laptops guys) and I’d be off to the races. Can probably get yourself an i7 and a 2080 for the same price. I’m actually thinking of doing that with my old work laptop, it has 10980 and Quadro 5000 32gb of ram and 2 m.2 slots. I can get a m.2 to Sata card and make myself a really nice little server out of it. My battery is still decent so i would have ups too. 2080 laptop = 2060 desktop with more memory, 3080 = 3060, 3080ti = 3070, 4090 = 4070. So you can get some great deals out there if you’re willing to dismantle the laptop, are comfortable using measurement tools, cad, and 3d printing.
reply
JJFX-
I'm getting flashbacks to a year ago. There are so many little issues AMD could avoid at launch by simply bringing a few more people from the OC community in-house for pre-launch testing. We're lucky to have the work Bill and his small team do but it seems they could really use more people focused on benching desktop parts. It never ceases to amaze me how quickly issues get discovered that never should have made it to retail. I can only imagine what access to internal tools would do.
I highly recommend people set most of their settings directly in AMD's bios menus instead of using the equivalent mobo UI. In my tests Asrock is fairly reliable overall now but issues like this don't surprise me. Their software/bios teams are the main thing holding back what is otherwise fantastic hardware now.
reply
I'm getting flashbacks to a year ago. There are so many little issues AMD could avoid at launch by simply bringing a few more people from the OC community in-house for pre-launch testing. We're lucky to have the work Bill and his small team do but it seems they could really use more people focused on benching desktop parts. It never ceases to amaze me how quickly issues get discovered that never should have made it to retail. I can only imagine what access to internal tools would do.
I highly recommend people set most of their settings directly in AMD's bios menus instead of using the equivalent mobo UI. In my tests Asrock is fairly reliable overall now but issues like this don't surprise me. Their software/bios teams are the main thing holding back what is otherwise fantastic hardware now.
reply
ShoguYT
I see this power draw drop is quite unregular and depends on the used motherboard. I saw yesterday other tests of these CPUs and the drop happened after 180s.
APU look not bad, but there should be something in between with 6 cores and 12 CUs expecially with this power limiting.
I also have small question if Steam Deck OLED testing landed in development hell I remember reading your comment under some post about starting testing around New Year and after that everything went quiet. Or maybe you want to make something like after 3 months review or something.
But remember to not overwork yourself. We need you to take care for youself and you should rest after this reviewing marathon. Take care
reply
I see this power draw drop is quite unregular and depends on the used motherboard. I saw yesterday other tests of these CPUs and the drop happened after 180s.
APU look not bad, but there should be something in between with 6 cores and 12 CUs expecially with this power limiting.
I also have small question if Steam Deck OLED testing landed in development hell I remember reading your comment under some post about starting testing around New Year and after that everything went quiet. Or maybe you want to make something like after 3 months review or something.
But remember to not overwork yourself. We need you to take care for youself and you should rest after this reviewing marathon. Take care
reply
fuzzylumpkins6034
Great content GN.
In short I see the apu is not worth the price for those on AM4 using every single cpu 2600x and above that is better and cheaper with an rx 6650 xt/ 6700xt and I cannot figure out who would be in the market for this as the am5 board/ ddr5 mem and this apu all come to a waste of money as there are so many am4 cpu/boards/ddr4 that will carry all of us right over skipping am5 chipset being pushed into ddr5 and a new board that we dont need.
Maybe I am missing something. Please tell me constantly current tech people that must waste hundreds and thousands of dollars/pounds to squeeze 5% of nothing out of something.
reply
Great content GN.
In short I see the apu is not worth the price for those on AM4 using every single cpu 2600x and above that is better and cheaper with an rx 6650 xt/ 6700xt and I cannot figure out who would be in the market for this as the am5 board/ ddr5 mem and this apu all come to a waste of money as there are so many am4 cpu/boards/ddr4 that will carry all of us right over skipping am5 chipset being pushed into ddr5 and a new board that we dont need.
Maybe I am missing something. Please tell me constantly current tech people that must waste hundreds and thousands of dollars/pounds to squeeze 5% of nothing out of something.
reply
xBinyWolf
8600G is really good for 229. Ok gets beaten by 12100f6500xt but you have upgrade path since you are on AM5 and no GPU. If you go i3scamXT you have to change the whole system (since i don't think you go ddr5) and resell value is really low. With this you can play every esport title some games with compromises and if you want to upgrade just slap in a gpu and if you want to upgrade cpu in a couple of years just slap an AM5 CPU. It's 400ish for the entire system but it is a good start for everyone even better if we include really low power/profile machines that we could build. 8700g is really meh if you don't strictly need 8 cores.
reply
8600G is really good for 229. Ok gets beaten by 12100f6500xt but you have upgrade path since you are on AM5 and no GPU. If you go i3scamXT you have to change the whole system (since i don't think you go ddr5) and resell value is really low. With this you can play every esport title some games with compromises and if you want to upgrade just slap in a gpu and if you want to upgrade cpu in a couple of years just slap an AM5 CPU. It's 400ish for the entire system but it is a good start for everyone even better if we include really low power/profile machines that we could build. 8700g is really meh if you don't strictly need 8 cores.
reply
hinokakera2009
I have the Ryzen 7 5700g (bought in 2022) GTX 1650 ( bought in 2020), and the only reason I did this combo was in case the GPU dies I wouldn't stuck with a computer without video (Went from i7 4770k to Ryzen 7 5700g, so was a big jump for me). For some contries and people sometimes you can't buy a new graphics cards in case your old one dies, so the 5600g and 5700g for a low price makes sense, and a good option.
But now that all AM5 processors have a basic gpu inside, and the high price for am5 8700g and 8600g ddr5 memory this combo doesn't make so much sense.
reply
I have the Ryzen 7 5700g (bought in 2022) GTX 1650 ( bought in 2020), and the only reason I did this combo was in case the GPU dies I wouldn't stuck with a computer without video (Went from i7 4770k to Ryzen 7 5700g, so was a big jump for me). For some contries and people sometimes you can't buy a new graphics cards in case your old one dies, so the 5600g and 5700g for a low price makes sense, and a good option.
But now that all AM5 processors have a basic gpu inside, and the high price for am5 8700g and 8600g ddr5 memory this combo doesn't make so much sense.
reply
fateunleashed9680
Great work as always GN! A swim through memory transfer rate pro/cons for these CPU's would be really interesting to see after you guys aren't drowning with other projects lol. Would be another great time to hammer home how terrible the IO options are, because you can quickly overspec yourself into terrible performance. You like having all that fast USBC, GPU, and more than 1 m.2 Welp, sucks you got the 8300G because you've earned less performance as punishment for not spending more! leather noises insert the more you buy the more you save meme leather noises
reply
Great work as always GN! A swim through memory transfer rate pro/cons for these CPU's would be really interesting to see after you guys aren't drowning with other projects lol. Would be another great time to hammer home how terrible the IO options are, because you can quickly overspec yourself into terrible performance. You like having all that fast USBC, GPU, and more than 1 m.2 Welp, sucks you got the 8300G because you've earned less performance as punishment for not spending more! leather noises insert the more you buy the more you save meme leather noises
reply
marxmaiale9981
Starting the iGPU benchmarks Excellent. A multitude of people actually use the integrated graphics for everything, mostly due to the computer either being a laptop, a prebuilt cheap computer, or an used office computer. I would like to see these also paired with the No External Power needed discrete GPUs as these will easily work their way into machines where the company uses some proprietary motherboard/power supply combination that does not have any PCIe power available.
reply
Starting the iGPU benchmarks Excellent. A multitude of people actually use the integrated graphics for everything, mostly due to the computer either being a laptop, a prebuilt cheap computer, or an used office computer. I would like to see these also paired with the No External Power needed discrete GPUs as these will easily work their way into machines where the company uses some proprietary motherboard/power supply combination that does not have any PCIe power available.
reply
TCHORG.
I don't know why these processors exist...
If someone wants a mini PC, they have a 7840U or Lenovo Legion Go, Which I recommend more than a miniPC because for not much more you can get a miniPC in dock and both consoles and a tablet/laptop..
Even as a transitional processor it makes no sense. The market will be saturated a month after the premiere because only freaks will buy it.
The cheapest used RX580 for $60 will be 20% faster than this processor's GPU.
reply
I don't know why these processors exist...
If someone wants a mini PC, they have a 7840U or Lenovo Legion Go, Which I recommend more than a miniPC because for not much more you can get a miniPC in dock and both consoles and a tablet/laptop..
Even as a transitional processor it makes no sense. The market will be saturated a month after the premiere because only freaks will buy it.
The cheapest used RX580 for $60 will be 20% faster than this processor's GPU.
reply
shieldtablet942
This 8700G is one of the worst priced products AMD has put out. Putting this out with such a bigger better number that plays worse than a 7600 is not good.
Just considering you have to factor an additional 8GB of DDR5 6400 to be price comparable... Is not good. This needs to be much cheaper.
Given the history with APUs, I wouldnt expct this to be so much slower. Who will want this The 8600G would be decent if it had the full GPU.
reply
This 8700G is one of the worst priced products AMD has put out. Putting this out with such a bigger better number that plays worse than a 7600 is not good.
Just considering you have to factor an additional 8GB of DDR5 6400 to be price comparable... Is not good. This needs to be much cheaper.
Given the history with APUs, I wouldnt expct this to be so much slower. Who will want this The 8600G would be decent if it had the full GPU.
reply
mechlost
Nice find before launch! But this video was sorely missing a bit of introduction...first 2 minutes should have been about where the issue originated from (mobile handheld devices that can struggle to stay cool if certain thermal limits are not in place) what STAPM actually stands for and what it does....and how that accidentally got transferred to the desktop for the 8600g/8700g parts. And that AMD is fixing the problem ASAP.
reply
Nice find before launch! But this video was sorely missing a bit of introduction...first 2 minutes should have been about where the issue originated from (mobile handheld devices that can struggle to stay cool if certain thermal limits are not in place) what STAPM actually stands for and what it does....and how that accidentally got transferred to the desktop for the 8600g/8700g parts. And that AMD is fixing the problem ASAP.
reply
fazzafizz7707
GamersNexus Dam just miss the discount Code, just placed an order yesterday for the mod mat, toolkit, coasters with 2 Glass and a shirt, I’m in Australia so $345US was $525AUD just missed it oh well still excited to get it and happy to support people that choose quality over quantity! Great work as always Steve and your team! Always Looking forward for more content!
reply
GamersNexus Dam just miss the discount Code, just placed an order yesterday for the mod mat, toolkit, coasters with 2 Glass and a shirt, I’m in Australia so $345US was $525AUD just missed it oh well still excited to get it and happy to support people that choose quality over quantity! Great work as always Steve and your team! Always Looking forward for more content!
reply
TheGreenReaper
In fairness ASUS GFX Core Offset voltage boost fails in the same way on my B650E-I with Ryzen 7600 on latest BIOS (and earlier) - you have to set it in the AMD pages. Regular CO works, as does the GFX frequency change, just not the voltage boost (limiting frequency). I guess not many have seriously tried overclocking the iGPU, though benefits are significant.
reply
In fairness ASUS GFX Core Offset voltage boost fails in the same way on my B650E-I with Ryzen 7600 on latest BIOS (and earlier) - you have to set it in the AMD pages. Regular CO works, as does the GFX frequency change, just not the voltage boost (limiting frequency). I guess not many have seriously tried overclocking the iGPU, though benefits are significant.
reply
The_Noticer.
I imagine you can pull quite a bit extra out of them if you loosen the constraints, manually tune the memory and undervolt/PBO2 tune the clocks. Ofcourse this is not relevant for a product review, as its all silicion lottery and you can't expect laymans to do that. But it would be interesting to see what you can get out of them with some tuning.
reply
I imagine you can pull quite a bit extra out of them if you loosen the constraints, manually tune the memory and undervolt/PBO2 tune the clocks. Ofcourse this is not relevant for a product review, as its all silicion lottery and you can't expect laymans to do that. But it would be interesting to see what you can get out of them with some tuning.
reply
etileno
These APUs interest me the most for budget focused and power efficient personal servers (i.e. Epyc wouldn't be of consideration). I built mine with a 5600G since I don't need a dedicated GPU, but some sort of graphical unit is still required. It runs a good handful of services under 50W on average, which is nice since electricity here is expensive.
reply
These APUs interest me the most for budget focused and power efficient personal servers (i.e. Epyc wouldn't be of consideration). I built mine with a 5600G since I don't need a dedicated GPU, but some sort of graphical unit is still required. It runs a good handful of services under 50W on average, which is nice since electricity here is expensive.
reply
TheOriginalJAX
Right so these APU's are kind of pointless the moment you want to pair a dedicated GPU up with them. Well knowing what some people in the audience are like as long as you can get one from a Micro centre in Europe or the UK then they will invent an excuse to buy them anyway because that is the age we live in now.
reply
Right so these APU's are kind of pointless the moment you want to pair a dedicated GPU up with them. Well knowing what some people in the audience are like as long as you can get one from a Micro centre in Europe or the UK then they will invent an excuse to buy them anyway because that is the age we live in now.
reply
chubbysumo2230
I think the biggest tractor of the current g-series processors that I see, is that the only have eight pcie 3.0 Lanes to the discreet gpu. AMD really dropped the ball here, they could have really had a winner on their hands for low end budget build-up systems, but they chose to gimp it. The 8500g is even worse.
reply
I think the biggest tractor of the current g-series processors that I see, is that the only have eight pcie 3.0 Lanes to the discreet gpu. AMD really dropped the ball here, they could have really had a winner on their hands for low end budget build-up systems, but they chose to gimp it. The 8500g is even worse.
reply
youcantata
RX780M/760M IGPU of Ryzen 8600G/8700G does not make sense. RX 780M IGPU should be coupled with low end CPU around $100-$150 like 5600G, not 8700G $330 APU. Ryzen 5600 RX6500 GPU combination is cheaper or similar in price than Ryzen 8600G/8700G but has 2 times game performance of the latter.
reply
RX780M/760M IGPU of Ryzen 8600G/8700G does not make sense. RX 780M IGPU should be coupled with low end CPU around $100-$150 like 5600G, not 8700G $330 APU. Ryzen 5600 RX6500 GPU combination is cheaper or similar in price than Ryzen 8600G/8700G but has 2 times game performance of the latter.
reply
Add a review, comment
Other channel videos
