Other Shop Sends Us A Jeep Compass With A Battery Draw
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Date: 2024-11-03
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Comments and reviews: 20
windward2818
The fog light relay contacts power feed is hot at all times. The rogue jumper as installed will essentially make a latching relay function which will never turn off until the relay is removed or the battery disconnected or discharge (the relay coil will drop out at perhaps 6 VDC. When the relay coil control is energized (fog lights on) it will activate the relay contacts, which will feed power back to the coil side keeping the relay on until you reset the relay by removing power to it. This latching relay configuration is very popular in control side (low voltage 12 VDC powered) industrial control panels when turning the panel ON by pressing the big GREEN round power on push button. To turn the machine off you have to open the control side power supply feed, using the big RED power off push button, the emergency stop, or interrupt the power by way of a safety interlock switch(s) (e. g. open door detect.
When on the relay should get warm because the coil is energized and dissipating power (approximately 3 Watts, which includes coil power and the output contact resistance power, but not as hot as what is shown in the video. This means the relay is getting hot from another heat source Perhaps, loose fitting mating contacts. So the original repair was an attempt to repair the relay terminals in the plastic power junction block because the customer complaint was the fog light would not work properly As a last resort (and poor thinking) why not just bypass the contacts and the relay with a jumper. So, we should ask ourselves are the relay contacts making good connection (sprung tangs) are they properly locked in place (can't get pushed back, why did someone use silicone Do we need to inspect the relay mating contacts in the power block
When the relay was removed how is it that the TIPM could supply the needed current to activate the fog lights The only answer I would have is the small stalk switch was supplying full current to the fog lights but not enough to blow the stalk switch fuse (10 Amp. Meaning for the fog light control circuit the TIPM is just a pass through Does this make sense
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The fog light relay contacts power feed is hot at all times. The rogue jumper as installed will essentially make a latching relay function which will never turn off until the relay is removed or the battery disconnected or discharge (the relay coil will drop out at perhaps 6 VDC. When the relay coil control is energized (fog lights on) it will activate the relay contacts, which will feed power back to the coil side keeping the relay on until you reset the relay by removing power to it. This latching relay configuration is very popular in control side (low voltage 12 VDC powered) industrial control panels when turning the panel ON by pressing the big GREEN round power on push button. To turn the machine off you have to open the control side power supply feed, using the big RED power off push button, the emergency stop, or interrupt the power by way of a safety interlock switch(s) (e. g. open door detect.
When on the relay should get warm because the coil is energized and dissipating power (approximately 3 Watts, which includes coil power and the output contact resistance power, but not as hot as what is shown in the video. This means the relay is getting hot from another heat source Perhaps, loose fitting mating contacts. So the original repair was an attempt to repair the relay terminals in the plastic power junction block because the customer complaint was the fog light would not work properly As a last resort (and poor thinking) why not just bypass the contacts and the relay with a jumper. So, we should ask ourselves are the relay contacts making good connection (sprung tangs) are they properly locked in place (can't get pushed back, why did someone use silicone Do we need to inspect the relay mating contacts in the power block
When the relay was removed how is it that the TIPM could supply the needed current to activate the fog lights The only answer I would have is the small stalk switch was supplying full current to the fog lights but not enough to blow the stalk switch fuse (10 Amp. Meaning for the fog light control circuit the TIPM is just a pass through Does this make sense
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joesepspindel3335
The only thing I can think of is that he wanted his running lights on at the same time his regular lights were on. On my car the running lights turn off as soon as I switch on the regular lights. Maybe he didn't want to bother (or he didn't know how) switching on his running lights with the other lights. I'm sure it wasn't the other shop that did it so I don't understand why he didn't inspect his own work after splicing in all that crap. People do the strangest stuff. I bought a bronco for cheap because it shut off after a while running and then wouldn't start again until it cooled down. When I went to put a new dimmer switch on the floor, you know the ones you have to step on, I noticed all the wires were twisted together and tucked away. They twisted the power wires up with the ground wire, blew out the low beam in the lights so it needed new headlights, and when the secondary electric fuel pump kicked in (bronco has two fuel pumps, one in the tank and one on the frame) the truck shut off because it was a common ground to the pump and the dimmer switch. I thought who the heck twists ground wires up together with power wires Truck ran fine after I put in a dimmer switch. I noticed the parts cannon was blasted all over that truck as they were trying to figure out why the truck didn't run for long. They gave up and I got a 1989 Bronco for three grand with a plow on it.
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The only thing I can think of is that he wanted his running lights on at the same time his regular lights were on. On my car the running lights turn off as soon as I switch on the regular lights. Maybe he didn't want to bother (or he didn't know how) switching on his running lights with the other lights. I'm sure it wasn't the other shop that did it so I don't understand why he didn't inspect his own work after splicing in all that crap. People do the strangest stuff. I bought a bronco for cheap because it shut off after a while running and then wouldn't start again until it cooled down. When I went to put a new dimmer switch on the floor, you know the ones you have to step on, I noticed all the wires were twisted together and tucked away. They twisted the power wires up with the ground wire, blew out the low beam in the lights so it needed new headlights, and when the secondary electric fuel pump kicked in (bronco has two fuel pumps, one in the tank and one on the frame) the truck shut off because it was a common ground to the pump and the dimmer switch. I thought who the heck twists ground wires up together with power wires Truck ran fine after I put in a dimmer switch. I noticed the parts cannon was blasted all over that truck as they were trying to figure out why the truck didn't run for long. They gave up and I got a 1989 Bronco for three grand with a plow on it.
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jkidd2007
I'm going to give you a brief replay of my 5 year parasitic draw for a 2012 Jeep Liberty, 130, 000 miles. Owned since it was new. Lifetime warranty from Chrysler and yet I've spent over $2, 000 in about labor plus 4 batteries (multiple deep discharges will kill the battery. Many free parts thrown at this and the final fix was the ABS controller. This also demonstrated itself with check engine plus various codes, but never related to the battery draw. The issue finally got worse this summer when the problem finally degraded to disable all dash instruments except fuel guage. No A/C, no radio, no GPS, all commanded actions like wipers coming on with headlights, doors locking after 8 mph, remote start. It has been fixed for 3 months now.
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I'm going to give you a brief replay of my 5 year parasitic draw for a 2012 Jeep Liberty, 130, 000 miles. Owned since it was new. Lifetime warranty from Chrysler and yet I've spent over $2, 000 in about labor plus 4 batteries (multiple deep discharges will kill the battery. Many free parts thrown at this and the final fix was the ABS controller. This also demonstrated itself with check engine plus various codes, but never related to the battery draw. The issue finally got worse this summer when the problem finally degraded to disable all dash instruments except fuel guage. No A/C, no radio, no GPS, all commanded actions like wipers coming on with headlights, doors locking after 8 mph, remote start. It has been fixed for 3 months now.
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Sandbag1300
Electrical is hard for lots of people. Need to know how to read wiring diagrams and understand voltage, amperage, ground, and signal wires. The person that made that repair had no clue. Had this happen to me last weekend. Traveling and check engine light went on. Took it to a shop. I knew the code, O2 sensor circuit high, but did not say anything. They pulled the code. Learned that the O2 sensor was not getting a ground. Took two mechanics 45 minutes to investigate to find the reason for no ground. Came back and said sell the car because it is too old. We said okay because it was clear they had no idea how to solve the problem.
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Electrical is hard for lots of people. Need to know how to read wiring diagrams and understand voltage, amperage, ground, and signal wires. The person that made that repair had no clue. Had this happen to me last weekend. Traveling and check engine light went on. Took it to a shop. I knew the code, O2 sensor circuit high, but did not say anything. They pulled the code. Learned that the O2 sensor was not getting a ground. Took two mechanics 45 minutes to investigate to find the reason for no ground. Came back and said sell the car because it is too old. We said okay because it was clear they had no idea how to solve the problem.
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tomoakhill8825
My car (not a Compass) has the default feature of keeping the headlights on for 2 minutes after you turn it off, to light your way to your apartment building door. I have no interest in reading the manual to learn how to defeat this, nor am I going to stand there looking back for 2 minutes. So if this 2 minute turn off every fails I will walk out to a dead battery. There is something seriously wrong when a person with 56 years of driving experience (me) has to read a 1, 126 page Owners Manual to learn how to operate their latest car. (Not to mention the 245 page secondary manual for the Central Counsel Computer)
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My car (not a Compass) has the default feature of keeping the headlights on for 2 minutes after you turn it off, to light your way to your apartment building door. I have no interest in reading the manual to learn how to defeat this, nor am I going to stand there looking back for 2 minutes. So if this 2 minute turn off every fails I will walk out to a dead battery. There is something seriously wrong when a person with 56 years of driving experience (me) has to read a 1, 126 page Owners Manual to learn how to operate their latest car. (Not to mention the 245 page secondary manual for the Central Counsel Computer)
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philipfoster373
I used to work at a auto electric shop and we ran into this kind of stuff every day that people let other people work on their vehicles and what I called them are wiring harness butchers. There is no reason for anyone to mess with the wiring harness unless there is a obvious open or shorted wire but people do go in and they start butchering everything causing nothing but problems everywhere and then places where they weren’t any problems at all. They should be a law like with doctors where are you can sue them malpractice And people who do that to themselves should be double charged.
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I used to work at a auto electric shop and we ran into this kind of stuff every day that people let other people work on their vehicles and what I called them are wiring harness butchers. There is no reason for anyone to mess with the wiring harness unless there is a obvious open or shorted wire but people do go in and they start butchering everything causing nothing but problems everywhere and then places where they weren’t any problems at all. They should be a law like with doctors where are you can sue them malpractice And people who do that to themselves should be double charged.
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greggc8088
I hate when Chrysler does that crap. Same color trigger wire as the same color light wire right beside each other. Too easy to mix up.
Had one the other day on a 2018 Renegade that the LF hi parking lights wouldn't work and the horn would blow when turning them on. Fix-Body shop had the front bumper cover off doing work and the connector for both will interchange and are in reach of each other. Park lamps plugged into the horn and horn plugged into the lamps. Fork Chrysle, even though that's what I'm driving at the moment.
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I hate when Chrysler does that crap. Same color trigger wire as the same color light wire right beside each other. Too easy to mix up.
Had one the other day on a 2018 Renegade that the LF hi parking lights wouldn't work and the horn would blow when turning them on. Fix-Body shop had the front bumper cover off doing work and the connector for both will interchange and are in reach of each other. Park lamps plugged into the horn and horn plugged into the lamps. Fork Chrysle, even though that's what I'm driving at the moment.
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topfloorstudio2684
I had a 2015 Jeep Patriot for 9 years since brand new, which is the same as this '16 Compass.
To the guy that says this isn't a real Jeep, you're wrong. I cared for/used my Pat for all she was worth lol. From 5 miles to 107, 000 miles it was 100% reliable. This video/problem & 99% of other problems with these FCA vehicles are because someone got in there and effed something up. Fiat Chrysler and now Stellantis are just as reliable a vehicle as say, Toyota, if bought new & properly cared for. change my mind
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I had a 2015 Jeep Patriot for 9 years since brand new, which is the same as this '16 Compass.
To the guy that says this isn't a real Jeep, you're wrong. I cared for/used my Pat for all she was worth lol. From 5 miles to 107, 000 miles it was 100% reliable. This video/problem & 99% of other problems with these FCA vehicles are because someone got in there and effed something up. Fiat Chrysler and now Stellantis are just as reliable a vehicle as say, Toyota, if bought new & properly cared for. change my mind
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autorepair
Having the same color wires put in reversed positions can easily happen on a GM. 2007 Silverado to be exact. Two Dark Blue wires from Left and Right Air Temperature Blend Door Actuators going into HVAC control module pins A2 and B2 can easily be reversed causing the actuators not to work and only blow hot or cold air only (usually hot only. If I remember right the Light Blues can get reversed too. A quick continuity test will reveal this. Dash removal is a PITA, start with the Left Lower.
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Having the same color wires put in reversed positions can easily happen on a GM. 2007 Silverado to be exact. Two Dark Blue wires from Left and Right Air Temperature Blend Door Actuators going into HVAC control module pins A2 and B2 can easily be reversed causing the actuators not to work and only blow hot or cold air only (usually hot only. If I remember right the Light Blues can get reversed too. A quick continuity test will reveal this. Dash removal is a PITA, start with the Left Lower.
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CuriousB58
What is weird is why the TIPM (totally insane power module) is staying active high on the control line after car shut down. Maybe fog lights are led and don’t draw much current so can be driven by control line, but why doesn’t that circuit time out after key off Wondering if the high current draw of the bulbs is latching the TIPM output. Might be just good luck the TIPM control line wasn’t damaged by the miswiring.
Another great mystery in the PRNY.
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What is weird is why the TIPM (totally insane power module) is staying active high on the control line after car shut down. Maybe fog lights are led and don’t draw much current so can be driven by control line, but why doesn’t that circuit time out after key off Wondering if the high current draw of the bulbs is latching the TIPM output. Might be just good luck the TIPM control line wasn’t damaged by the miswiring.
Another great mystery in the PRNY.
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cuebuilder969
So what the other shop did is to create a self feeding loop, right When you turn on the fog lights, then you can't turn them off because the relay stays latched. Is that right I can only think that this jeep came from a body shop and they cut the wires, or they were cut in an accident and then the body shop wired it up on the wrong side of the relay input, creating a self feeding circuit once energized and keeping the relay latched once turned on.
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So what the other shop did is to create a self feeding loop, right When you turn on the fog lights, then you can't turn them off because the relay stays latched. Is that right I can only think that this jeep came from a body shop and they cut the wires, or they were cut in an accident and then the body shop wired it up on the wrong side of the relay input, creating a self feeding circuit once energized and keeping the relay latched once turned on.
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CJE2007. 5
My guess is that the person who owns that rig wanted the fog lights to stay on all the time while switching between low beam and high beam. I believe that they make a relay for that purpose. It's an option on programmer/tuners that you can choose to to keep fog lights on all the time, at least on the diesel side of things anyway. That's the only reason I think someone would do that.
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My guess is that the person who owns that rig wanted the fog lights to stay on all the time while switching between low beam and high beam. I believe that they make a relay for that purpose. It's an option on programmer/tuners that you can choose to to keep fog lights on all the time, at least on the diesel side of things anyway. That's the only reason I think someone would do that.
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Mtltrm
The technician at the other shop saw that there were three wires all the same color and instead of checking an actual wiring diagram, they spliced all the same colored wires together.
Monumental mistake, of course Chrysler in their infinite wisdom, should have made the tracer of one of the three wires a different color IMHO
Great diagnosis Eric and once again you saved the day
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The technician at the other shop saw that there were three wires all the same color and instead of checking an actual wiring diagram, they spliced all the same colored wires together.
Monumental mistake, of course Chrysler in their infinite wisdom, should have made the tracer of one of the three wires a different color IMHO
Great diagnosis Eric and once again you saved the day
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nigelcox1451
Was this just a simple mistake, of joining all the white/yellows together Not paying enough attention to circuits and wire gauge, and not thinking any manufacturer might use the same colour in and out.
In the seventies, Citroen often used all black wires, for everything, putting a small coloured sleeve at each end next to the connector. Splicing anything was a nightmare.
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Was this just a simple mistake, of joining all the white/yellows together Not paying enough attention to circuits and wire gauge, and not thinking any manufacturer might use the same colour in and out.
In the seventies, Citroen often used all black wires, for everything, putting a small coloured sleeve at each end next to the connector. Splicing anything was a nightmare.
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simonilett998
He was testing out the self latching relay theory he just learned on the internet.
Probably to keep the fog lights on when switched to high beam and thought they'd go off when the key is turned off.
Fog light positive feed comes on, triggers relay and keeps the relay on, constant power on the feed even when the key is off keeps the relay chooching to the fog lights
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He was testing out the self latching relay theory he just learned on the internet.
Probably to keep the fog lights on when switched to high beam and thought they'd go off when the key is turned off.
Fog light positive feed comes on, triggers relay and keeps the relay on, constant power on the feed even when the key is off keeps the relay chooching to the fog lights
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NBSV1
Funny to me how much effort people will go through to make the fog lights work with the high beams. Considering when the high beams are on you don’t need fog lights since you should be looking farther ahead. And in dense fog you shouldn’t have the high beams on since they just glare and you can’t see that far anyway. Almost like they work from the factory like they should.
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Funny to me how much effort people will go through to make the fog lights work with the high beams. Considering when the high beams are on you don’t need fog lights since you should be looking farther ahead. And in dense fog you shouldn’t have the high beams on since they just glare and you can’t see that far anyway. Almost like they work from the factory like they should.
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donaldhollums3278
Dang Son, what a butt chapper! I hope you send a bill to the shop for the mechanic that created the soup-sandwich that you had to take the time to clean up.
It’s great to have a quality Better-half, ain’t it Mr. Eric! I’ve been married to mine for 22 years and she has been married to me for 220 years. Every year of marriage for me is ten years for her.
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Dang Son, what a butt chapper! I hope you send a bill to the shop for the mechanic that created the soup-sandwich that you had to take the time to clean up.
It’s great to have a quality Better-half, ain’t it Mr. Eric! I’ve been married to mine for 22 years and she has been married to me for 220 years. Every year of marriage for me is ten years for her.
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jeffcompton6937
Wouldn't it be a great world if customers actually told shops everything done too a vehicle when they wind up with a ln electrical issue. Just because they assume it cant be related doesn't mean the pros that actually do know it is. A big detective job all because customer tried too modify the circuit and couldnt grasp that it might cause a drain.
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Wouldn't it be a great world if customers actually told shops everything done too a vehicle when they wind up with a ln electrical issue. Just because they assume it cant be related doesn't mean the pros that actually do know it is. A big detective job all because customer tried too modify the circuit and couldnt grasp that it might cause a drain.
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edwintaber6465
So it is likely that headlight engineering is more highway centered with little to no consideration for rural deer-country driving. We also have night wet road black hole situations that you enter and pray you exit alive. It would be nice to have adjustable road edge lights esp on the right side.
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So it is likely that headlight engineering is more highway centered with little to no consideration for rural deer-country driving. We also have night wet road black hole situations that you enter and pray you exit alive. It would be nice to have adjustable road edge lights esp on the right side.
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mrdfoutz
Dr. O with yet another exceptional diagnosis and successful surgery. With assistance from the lovely and talented Mrs. O! I know one of the other reasons you keep her around is her accuracy with those long-range hole punchers! Which brings up another point: We want more After Hours target challenge!
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Dr. O with yet another exceptional diagnosis and successful surgery. With assistance from the lovely and talented Mrs. O! I know one of the other reasons you keep her around is her accuracy with those long-range hole punchers! Which brings up another point: We want more After Hours target challenge!
reply
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