How AMD is Fighting NVIDIA with RDNA3 - Chiplet Engineering Explained
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Date: 2022-11-22
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Comments and reviews: 14
Lawyer
Based on all the different videos , reviews , leaks and articles I m seeing . It s evident , than AMD s manufacturing costs this generation , are considerably lower than Nvidia s.
Pricing the 7900XTX wich is supposed to be in the 4080 tier of performance, for only 199 less, very likely means that AMD is being just as greedy as Nvidia. And yes , I know that we as costumers, don t care the reason why it is cheaper , the thing is it is cheaper and therefore better bang for the buck for us.
But the point is , that everyone is accusing Nvidia of be greedy, and based on the known information, AMD is not pricing their products aggressively, on the contrary , they are probably pricing them with a higher % of revenue per product than the one Nvidia has.
Wich very likely means , they had more than enough room , to price the 7900XTX at 899 and the 7900XT at 799 .
But they probably also have remaining stock of unsold 6000 cards and that would kill the sales on those.
Or they could have kept the 999 and 899 prices , and use the extra margin in revenue capacity, to add better ray tracing capacity to the cards with out having to augment the price , there was room for it.
But they are just as greedy as Nvidia , if not more.
Amd is not priced Aggressively as some people sugest.
They didn t won Nvidia this generation, because they thought more about the costumer.
They won because they thought much better about production costs.
They had the opportunity to offer 4080 performance, at 800 quit
But they knew that with Nvidia pricing their cards at 1199 and 1499 respectively, they could comfortably price their top dog at 999 and look like working class heroes.
I missed the memo where 999 was a freaking bargain.
You people are sheep.
reply
Based on all the different videos , reviews , leaks and articles I m seeing . It s evident , than AMD s manufacturing costs this generation , are considerably lower than Nvidia s.
Pricing the 7900XTX wich is supposed to be in the 4080 tier of performance, for only 199 less, very likely means that AMD is being just as greedy as Nvidia. And yes , I know that we as costumers, don t care the reason why it is cheaper , the thing is it is cheaper and therefore better bang for the buck for us.
But the point is , that everyone is accusing Nvidia of be greedy, and based on the known information, AMD is not pricing their products aggressively, on the contrary , they are probably pricing them with a higher % of revenue per product than the one Nvidia has.
Wich very likely means , they had more than enough room , to price the 7900XTX at 899 and the 7900XT at 799 .
But they probably also have remaining stock of unsold 6000 cards and that would kill the sales on those.
Or they could have kept the 999 and 899 prices , and use the extra margin in revenue capacity, to add better ray tracing capacity to the cards with out having to augment the price , there was room for it.
But they are just as greedy as Nvidia , if not more.
Amd is not priced Aggressively as some people sugest.
They didn t won Nvidia this generation, because they thought more about the costumer.
They won because they thought much better about production costs.
They had the opportunity to offer 4080 performance, at 800 quit
But they knew that with Nvidia pricing their cards at 1199 and 1499 respectively, they could comfortably price their top dog at 999 and look like working class heroes.
I missed the memo where 999 was a freaking bargain.
You people are sheep.
reply
Lawyer
The 6900XT went head to head with the 1499 3090 in razterization performance.
And it costed 999
The 6800XT went head to head with the 699 3080 , and costed 649
Now the 7900XTX (not even XT)
Is going head to head , with the 4080!
Not 4090! (AMD said it , not me)
For the same 999 . (In ratserization performance)
AMD is naming what should have been a 7800XT In terms of performance in comparison to the competition a 7900XTX
And pricing it at 999
And straight up not launching a 4090 competitor , so that the 7900XTX name sounds logic , hey it s our top card.
Yeah well , your top card , is going against Nvidia s second card (and second by a margin this gen) while being priced the same as the card that last gen went head to head with Nvidia s top dog.
Nvidia rised the 4090 price by 100
Gamers Outrage.
AMD named a 7800XT a 7900XT and priced it at 1000 wich is a 350 increase of the 800msrp
Gamers: Dickriding
The fact that Nvidia went full retarded , and priced a 4080 at 1199
Doesn t means that AMD is also laughing at your faces.
Had the 4080 been launched for 999
You people would be outraged that the 7900XTX is going against the 4080 in terms of performance and not against the 4090
People thinks AMD helps keep Nvidia s pricing real.
But the truth is that AMD is using Nvidia s pricing to increase their prices with out backlash.
Nvidia is eating the hate for them.
And when the 4090ti launches for around 2000
They will launch a 7950XTX mail hat goes against the already 1 year old 4090 , but at 1300 and you will cock-ride them again.
Ignoring that the 7950 should have gone against the 4090ti
Not the 4090
reply
The 6900XT went head to head with the 1499 3090 in razterization performance.
And it costed 999
The 6800XT went head to head with the 699 3080 , and costed 649
Now the 7900XTX (not even XT)
Is going head to head , with the 4080!
Not 4090! (AMD said it , not me)
For the same 999 . (In ratserization performance)
AMD is naming what should have been a 7800XT In terms of performance in comparison to the competition a 7900XTX
And pricing it at 999
And straight up not launching a 4090 competitor , so that the 7900XTX name sounds logic , hey it s our top card.
Yeah well , your top card , is going against Nvidia s second card (and second by a margin this gen) while being priced the same as the card that last gen went head to head with Nvidia s top dog.
Nvidia rised the 4090 price by 100
Gamers Outrage.
AMD named a 7800XT a 7900XT and priced it at 1000 wich is a 350 increase of the 800msrp
Gamers: Dickriding
The fact that Nvidia went full retarded , and priced a 4080 at 1199
Doesn t means that AMD is also laughing at your faces.
Had the 4080 been launched for 999
You people would be outraged that the 7900XTX is going against the 4080 in terms of performance and not against the 4090
People thinks AMD helps keep Nvidia s pricing real.
But the truth is that AMD is using Nvidia s pricing to increase their prices with out backlash.
Nvidia is eating the hate for them.
And when the 4090ti launches for around 2000
They will launch a 7950XTX mail hat goes against the already 1 year old 4090 , but at 1300 and you will cock-ride them again.
Ignoring that the 7950 should have gone against the 4090ti
Not the 4090
reply
Creative
Well seems to be the going trend on the comments but why not add to the pile lol. I liked this video a lot. I really liked hearing all the nuances of what AMD is doing and how they are improving their designs while also being cost effective. I wanted to buy AMD last go around but was very on the fence. After seeing this video though it gave me much much greater confidence that the switch to AMD is the way to go. Thank you so much for this video. Hope to see many more like this. I really love the behind the scenes videos like the tour of Kingpins lab at EVGA. Hope to hear whats going on with Kingpin soon!!!
reply
Well seems to be the going trend on the comments but why not add to the pile lol. I liked this video a lot. I really liked hearing all the nuances of what AMD is doing and how they are improving their designs while also being cost effective. I wanted to buy AMD last go around but was very on the fence. After seeing this video though it gave me much much greater confidence that the switch to AMD is the way to go. Thank you so much for this video. Hope to see many more like this. I really love the behind the scenes videos like the tour of Kingpins lab at EVGA. Hope to hear whats going on with Kingpin soon!!!
reply
bacintom
This teaches a lot of stuff. Now I'm sad because I thought they had a scalable chiplet design like zen, with one IO chip in the middle and a bunch of small computing chips around it. Turns out it's the opposite, the computation is done by a monolithic die in the middle, and the small chips are IO. So, they do save money on manufacturing but this design is not more scalable that the previous ones. They can't just add chips and get computational improvement (like with a threadripper). Too bad, that would really have killed Nvidia over the years.
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This teaches a lot of stuff. Now I'm sad because I thought they had a scalable chiplet design like zen, with one IO chip in the middle and a bunch of small computing chips around it. Turns out it's the opposite, the computation is done by a monolithic die in the middle, and the small chips are IO. So, they do save money on manufacturing but this design is not more scalable that the previous ones. They can't just add chips and get computational improvement (like with a threadripper). Too bad, that would really have killed Nvidia over the years.
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eloj
11:10 .. 14:42 I wish you'd really drilled into whether -- long term -- multiple compute chiplets is the plan. This presentation seems to use the size of the required interconnect to explain why it's not here. Fair enough, but it's unclear to me if he's discounting the idea as a whole or not. Cause without that, chiplet scaling on GPU seems way more limited than CPU. I think at some point we'll have to go multi-GCD, even if inital designs end up presenting separate GCDs as separate queues with relatively limited inter-communication.
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11:10 .. 14:42 I wish you'd really drilled into whether -- long term -- multiple compute chiplets is the plan. This presentation seems to use the size of the required interconnect to explain why it's not here. Fair enough, but it's unclear to me if he's discounting the idea as a whole or not. Cause without that, chiplet scaling on GPU seems way more limited than CPU. I think at some point we'll have to go multi-GCD, even if inital designs end up presenting separate GCDs as separate queues with relatively limited inter-communication.
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OneAngryCat
This is also why I like AMD:
Nvidia: RTX 4090 best card ever, beats RTX 3090 Ti former best card ever, we are best ever, buy for the low price of 1600
AMD: We have built this tech for cost cutting, this tech for easier encoding, this tech for lower power consumption, this tech for...it's 1000 and you get all that and we'll keep going forward
One company touts loudly that they're the best, one company gives clear explanations of why and how they're bettering tech and why you should buy.
reply
This is also why I like AMD:
Nvidia: RTX 4090 best card ever, beats RTX 3090 Ti former best card ever, we are best ever, buy for the low price of 1600
AMD: We have built this tech for cost cutting, this tech for easier encoding, this tech for lower power consumption, this tech for...it's 1000 and you get all that and we'll keep going forward
One company touts loudly that they're the best, one company gives clear explanations of why and how they're bettering tech and why you should buy.
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Keith
When people upgrade (most are not experts ) they tend to stay with the same brands. AMD has the opportunity steal away some of the most valuable customers in the gaming market. They need to undercut, and keep undercutting Nvidia. My last few cards had GTX in the name. But after using this 6800xt without issue for several months I can say Nvidia does not have my attention anymore. Most gamers cant afford to spend money creating more then 120 frames a second(119.6 is my average in codmw2 on ultra 1440p).
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When people upgrade (most are not experts ) they tend to stay with the same brands. AMD has the opportunity steal away some of the most valuable customers in the gaming market. They need to undercut, and keep undercutting Nvidia. My last few cards had GTX in the name. But after using this 6800xt without issue for several months I can say Nvidia does not have my attention anymore. Most gamers cant afford to spend money creating more then 120 frames a second(119.6 is my average in codmw2 on ultra 1440p).
reply
sebastiaan
This is a great video. The thing I don't understand is that sli/crossfire did not work and had a lot of issieus now we are going to use multiple chiplets, hope this works.
I understand sli was combining soc's and this is just logic chiplets on a io die but still.
If this works it like reusable rockets or electric cars.
Would love to try this tech and see if it's good, i'm afraid of micro stutters but that's not based on science but on experience of the past with different tech
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This is a great video. The thing I don't understand is that sli/crossfire did not work and had a lot of issieus now we are going to use multiple chiplets, hope this works.
I understand sli was combining soc's and this is just logic chiplets on a io die but still.
If this works it like reusable rockets or electric cars.
Would love to try this tech and see if it's good, i'm afraid of micro stutters but that's not based on science but on experience of the past with different tech
reply
Eduardo
Don't you love when you finally get to see a little crumb or humanity from a big company? Because most people perceive large technology companies as a big, opaque hive mind but this interview goes to show that clever allocation of engineering work force, reducing power consumption, optimizing design while driving down costs are extremely important, and there's actually passionate people behind all this, it's not just design new architecture and profit kind of deal
reply
Don't you love when you finally get to see a little crumb or humanity from a big company? Because most people perceive large technology companies as a big, opaque hive mind but this interview goes to show that clever allocation of engineering work force, reducing power consumption, optimizing design while driving down costs are extremely important, and there's actually passionate people behind all this, it's not just design new architecture and profit kind of deal
reply
Logan
Wow, what a treat to get such an in depth take on why the tech is such a benefit. Really interesting stuff! Amd is just ahead of everyone else right now. And this is probably why Nvidias prices are out of control. I have been watching carefully, and in the last 7 years, their prices have pretty much doubled. Anyone concerned with price/performance will be going Amd graphics this generation. And thats a large portion of buyers.
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Wow, what a treat to get such an in depth take on why the tech is such a benefit. Really interesting stuff! Amd is just ahead of everyone else right now. And this is probably why Nvidias prices are out of control. I have been watching carefully, and in the last 7 years, their prices have pretty much doubled. Anyone concerned with price/performance will be going Amd graphics this generation. And thats a large portion of buyers.
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Jon
A company called Silicon Edge has an online die-per-wafer estimator (search for silicon edge die per wafer estimator and it should be the first result) that really helps illustrate how big of an impact even a small reduction in die size can have on yields. As Naffziger said, defects tend to stabilize around a constant number per wafer, so play around with the die dimensions and see how much of an effect it has.
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A company called Silicon Edge has an online die-per-wafer estimator (search for silicon edge die per wafer estimator and it should be the first result) that really helps illustrate how big of an impact even a small reduction in die size can have on yields. As Naffziger said, defects tend to stabilize around a constant number per wafer, so play around with the die dimensions and see how much of an effect it has.
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Zadrigo
Fantastic video. But the funniest thing is I realized how delighted I was that the laptop which was used for presentation slides was not Macbook, but Windows-based. Even though its probably some Microsoft stuff, that is a sign of a proper engineer, not some marketing fly-by or game developer, the types that can be easily recognized by their substandard and compatibility-problematic Apple equipment.
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Fantastic video. But the funniest thing is I realized how delighted I was that the laptop which was used for presentation slides was not Macbook, but Windows-based. Even though its probably some Microsoft stuff, that is a sign of a proper engineer, not some marketing fly-by or game developer, the types that can be easily recognized by their substandard and compatibility-problematic Apple equipment.
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Will
Love listening to engineers, massive respect to him for giving us a look behind the scenes about this stuff even if it's AMD allowing him to speak to help show things. Super cool thing to do occasionally and everyone wins. Hope he doesn't mind having to do this speaking stuff especially with all the PR training they put people under for good reason, he's a great presenter and we really appreciate it
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Love listening to engineers, massive respect to him for giving us a look behind the scenes about this stuff even if it's AMD allowing him to speak to help show things. Super cool thing to do occasionally and everyone wins. Hope he doesn't mind having to do this speaking stuff especially with all the PR training they put people under for good reason, he's a great presenter and we really appreciate it
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gstorm
Not surprising his name is Sam.
He definitely has already red DNA inside, using smart access memory, here just Infinity caching out his thousand times performed presentation, nothing weird he looks bit more energy efficient, but still clear to us, with nice low frametimes, pumping Adrenaline into everyone, who gets compatible hardware just in mind.
Good luck to Steve too, great talk.
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Not surprising his name is Sam.
He definitely has already red DNA inside, using smart access memory, here just Infinity caching out his thousand times performed presentation, nothing weird he looks bit more energy efficient, but still clear to us, with nice low frametimes, pumping Adrenaline into everyone, who gets compatible hardware just in mind.
Good luck to Steve too, great talk.
reply
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