AMD Strikes Back: Zen 5 CPU Architecture Changes & Chipset Differences (X870E vs. X870, B850, B840)
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Date: 2024-07-19
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Comments and reviews: 20
tbas8741
What bugs me about these new release is when they released the Ryzen AM4 platform series or whatever (maybe even AM3 Platform time) they already knew or had already built the AM5 Chips and their architexture but no way wold they skip upgradable generations as that makes more money.
I bet when machines were making mass produced first AM4 CPU's the Tech team was already testing and working with AM5 cpu's like these 9xxx series.
I know most companies do it like with Iphone when Iphone 10 came out 11 and 12 wsere already designed planned and built for testing and Apple intentionally sold them in stages to force upgrades and scam people out of their money just like Intel and AMD also do.
Like how Intel Knew about 13th 14th gen Problems but still sold them and didnt care as they already have the next 2 Generations built (maybe even cpu's to be released in 2030 already being tested) But intel still released 13/14th gen as it made them money, they just had to lie and pretend they didnt know.
Yes all that is legal in Australia law you can say anything about a company or make ANY claim as long as its not singling out 1 person or group of people within that company, Like i can call Intel the worst things possible and they cant say a word as im not American
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What bugs me about these new release is when they released the Ryzen AM4 platform series or whatever (maybe even AM3 Platform time) they already knew or had already built the AM5 Chips and their architexture but no way wold they skip upgradable generations as that makes more money.
I bet when machines were making mass produced first AM4 CPU's the Tech team was already testing and working with AM5 cpu's like these 9xxx series.
I know most companies do it like with Iphone when Iphone 10 came out 11 and 12 wsere already designed planned and built for testing and Apple intentionally sold them in stages to force upgrades and scam people out of their money just like Intel and AMD also do.
Like how Intel Knew about 13th 14th gen Problems but still sold them and didnt care as they already have the next 2 Generations built (maybe even cpu's to be released in 2030 already being tested) But intel still released 13/14th gen as it made them money, they just had to lie and pretend they didnt know.
Yes all that is legal in Australia law you can say anything about a company or make ANY claim as long as its not singling out 1 person or group of people within that company, Like i can call Intel the worst things possible and they cant say a word as im not American
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gottahavitvt
So first of all I'm a huge AM4 fan. This one I've been biting my lip on for a bit. Everyone is complimenting AMD on AM5 and bashing intel for EOLing MB/socket support, but Intel has already released 3(ok 2.5) generation on LGA 1700 and yes in theory is EOL(maybe not), but AMD while it hasn't EOL'd it's AM5 boards it hasn't even released a 2nd gen CPU on AM5 yet, so how may generations are we really going to get it's been 2 years since 7600x(and others) came out, so if we get the 4rd gen in 2 years, that's nearly the end of 2026 and I would question we will get a 4th. AM4 generation were released just over a year apart and we got 4 generations in 5 years (5 if you 're counting 4000s)
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So first of all I'm a huge AM4 fan. This one I've been biting my lip on for a bit. Everyone is complimenting AMD on AM5 and bashing intel for EOLing MB/socket support, but Intel has already released 3(ok 2.5) generation on LGA 1700 and yes in theory is EOL(maybe not), but AMD while it hasn't EOL'd it's AM5 boards it hasn't even released a 2nd gen CPU on AM5 yet, so how may generations are we really going to get it's been 2 years since 7600x(and others) came out, so if we get the 4rd gen in 2 years, that's nearly the end of 2026 and I would question we will get a 4th. AM4 generation were released just over a year apart and we got 4 generations in 5 years (5 if you 're counting 4000s)
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PhotoSmithy_Canada
Was discussing cpus with a fellow techie and we both agreed that it would be nice to see 20 core higher freq variant of the 7980x. Threadripper does have some Epyc structure to it and that would mean there would not be a need for x3D. Not quite as quick as x3D however with a trx50 motherboard you have considerably better motherboard performance and lets be honest recent consumer level motherboards for either Intel or amd have been junk. In general a physical 20 core thread ripper would use considerably less power and produce less heat as well as never having a bottle neck. There would be room for a better iGPU if deemed necessary since the current Zen only had a 2core iGPU.
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Was discussing cpus with a fellow techie and we both agreed that it would be nice to see 20 core higher freq variant of the 7980x. Threadripper does have some Epyc structure to it and that would mean there would not be a need for x3D. Not quite as quick as x3D however with a trx50 motherboard you have considerably better motherboard performance and lets be honest recent consumer level motherboards for either Intel or amd have been junk. In general a physical 20 core thread ripper would use considerably less power and produce less heat as well as never having a bottle neck. There would be room for a better iGPU if deemed necessary since the current Zen only had a 2core iGPU.
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syntehk
Hey Steve Burke and associates, I realize this is a lottle bit tin foil hat talk, but ya'll ever contemplate the possibility that where we're at now with the size of silicon based transistors is on purpose rather than the actual frontier I wonder this myself after reading Micho Kaku's Physics of the Impossible where he posits that when we reach the limit of how a transistor can be with modern standards, then we will experience a global economic depression; if i remember correctly his estimate is that it would take place around the year 2020.
For a little more context from my perspective I'm paused at 4 seconds into this video, and I'm the slightest bit inebriated.
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Hey Steve Burke and associates, I realize this is a lottle bit tin foil hat talk, but ya'll ever contemplate the possibility that where we're at now with the size of silicon based transistors is on purpose rather than the actual frontier I wonder this myself after reading Micho Kaku's Physics of the Impossible where he posits that when we reach the limit of how a transistor can be with modern standards, then we will experience a global economic depression; if i remember correctly his estimate is that it would take place around the year 2020.
For a little more context from my perspective I'm paused at 4 seconds into this video, and I'm the slightest bit inebriated.
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Wooskii1
Wait, do they actually still make mobos without NVME! I mean anything normal you would put in a gaming rig like atx...
It's pretty cool to have gotten back into PC gaming on AM4 and not have to abandon my blatant AMD fanboyism due to intel dominating as I feared. I think I heard something happened to AND during my leave and my friend from highschool has been rocking Intel for a couple generations. Still, wild clock speeds these days! I quit on AM3, and caught AM4 just at the end (5900x still feeling like it will be strong for years to come!). I just wish the market for the other interesting part of a build (GPU) could be as interesting.
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Wait, do they actually still make mobos without NVME! I mean anything normal you would put in a gaming rig like atx...
It's pretty cool to have gotten back into PC gaming on AM4 and not have to abandon my blatant AMD fanboyism due to intel dominating as I feared. I think I heard something happened to AND during my leave and my friend from highschool has been rocking Intel for a couple generations. Still, wild clock speeds these days! I quit on AM3, and caught AM4 just at the end (5900x still feeling like it will be strong for years to come!). I just wish the market for the other interesting part of a build (GPU) could be as interesting.
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conorstewart2214
Why such a step back to gen 3 on a platform that supports gen 5, even on the budget CPUs
That gen 3 is such a mistake. Budget GPUs now sometimes come with PCIe gen4x8, rather than the traditional x16 slot. You can argue that it will still work fine and not be bottlenecked at gen3x8 but that isn’t the point, why didn’t they just go for gen 4
That B840 chipset seems worse than or equal to my B450 I am using just now in most ways. It has PCIe gen 3 with a x16 slot, it has some form of usb 3.x gen 2 (10 Gbps), it can overclock the CPU and RAM. The only advantage of the B840 is likely that it uses DDR5.
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Why such a step back to gen 3 on a platform that supports gen 5, even on the budget CPUs
That gen 3 is such a mistake. Budget GPUs now sometimes come with PCIe gen4x8, rather than the traditional x16 slot. You can argue that it will still work fine and not be bottlenecked at gen3x8 but that isn’t the point, why didn’t they just go for gen 4
That B840 chipset seems worse than or equal to my B450 I am using just now in most ways. It has PCIe gen 3 with a x16 slot, it has some form of usb 3.x gen 2 (10 Gbps), it can overclock the CPU and RAM. The only advantage of the B840 is likely that it uses DDR5.
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CalgarGTX
B840 boards better cost 50$ or less or its a total noob trap. pcie3 in 2024 smh
Can't talk all day about longterm platform longevity if your platform already has an obsolete feature set from day 1.
Main reason I upgraded my previous 2013 4700K setup this year was because I was fed up of being stuck on slow pcie3 SATA SSDs (nvme and M2 slots weren't a thing at that time) Even (some at least) B650 boards have pcie5 storage slots.
pcie3 is also already a problem for entry level GPUs that would logically be paired with an entry level board since both sides went x8 wide to save a few cents.
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B840 boards better cost 50$ or less or its a total noob trap. pcie3 in 2024 smh
Can't talk all day about longterm platform longevity if your platform already has an obsolete feature set from day 1.
Main reason I upgraded my previous 2013 4700K setup this year was because I was fed up of being stuck on slow pcie3 SATA SSDs (nvme and M2 slots weren't a thing at that time) Even (some at least) B650 boards have pcie5 storage slots.
pcie3 is also already a problem for entry level GPUs that would logically be paired with an entry level board since both sides went x8 wide to save a few cents.
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cracklingice
having a hard time getting people to migrate off that platform....
I just bought that platform. haha Hard to resist $213 X570 Taichi with a $187 5700X3D. I need a board with dual 8 lane slots for what I want out of my computer and to go with Intel or AM5 would have been like 50% more expensive for the CPU, board and 64GB of memory (yes a portion of that increase is just that DDR4 is cheap while DDR5 is average priced, but a CPU without memory does not function so the value must be based on the base platform cost).
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having a hard time getting people to migrate off that platform....
I just bought that platform. haha Hard to resist $213 X570 Taichi with a $187 5700X3D. I need a board with dual 8 lane slots for what I want out of my computer and to go with Intel or AM5 would have been like 50% more expensive for the CPU, board and 64GB of memory (yes a portion of that increase is just that DDR4 is cheap while DDR5 is average priced, but a CPU without memory does not function so the value must be based on the base platform cost).
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connorharris1900
I don’t understand the point of making anything new and not as high performance as possible. CPU GPU NPU or APU. if people don’t require more performance then older processor nodes and cheaper manufacturing should be used. it’s just wasteful and irresponsible to manufacture new chips at lower bins that perform the same as older generations. I’m getting frustrated with silicon designers lack of wit and innovation. (excluding nvidia)
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I don’t understand the point of making anything new and not as high performance as possible. CPU GPU NPU or APU. if people don’t require more performance then older processor nodes and cheaper manufacturing should be used. it’s just wasteful and irresponsible to manufacture new chips at lower bins that perform the same as older generations. I’m getting frustrated with silicon designers lack of wit and innovation. (excluding nvidia)
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philipp594
I would have asked the engineers 5 questions:
- how many more cores
- how much more cache
- how much more infinity fabric bandwith
- how much less power draw
- how much lower msrp
That’s all we need to know.
IPC gains are nice. But that should be a bonus, not the key selling point.
This cpu still doesn’t outperform their 5800X3D in the games most people play. Even in their own benchmarks.
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I would have asked the engineers 5 questions:
- how many more cores
- how much more cache
- how much more infinity fabric bandwith
- how much less power draw
- how much lower msrp
That’s all we need to know.
IPC gains are nice. But that should be a bonus, not the key selling point.
This cpu still doesn’t outperform their 5800X3D in the games most people play. Even in their own benchmarks.
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antonnjames4626
The L3 cache bump on the single CCD parts is healthy, up from the already pretty good 32MB on the 7600X/7700X. Interesting that AMD don’t scale it linearly by core count either this or last generation. Proportionally the 7600X and 9600X have more cache per core than the 8 core parts do. Wonder how much this works to limit the 6c vs 8c performance difference in applications which utilise cache sufficiently
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The L3 cache bump on the single CCD parts is healthy, up from the already pretty good 32MB on the 7600X/7700X. Interesting that AMD don’t scale it linearly by core count either this or last generation. Proportionally the 7600X and 9600X have more cache per core than the 8 core parts do. Wonder how much this works to limit the 6c vs 8c performance difference in applications which utilise cache sufficiently
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gamersnexus
Gamers care about this nonsense how This matters how These new CPUs mean something to someone, but certainly an audience of around 100 people. Globally. When most people used 1060 GPUs, how many are excited to learn about CPUs that have features and specs that nobody in their right mind would ever need or care about. Great that you cover such nonsense. If you didn't, who would Good luck on the affiliate income.
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Gamers care about this nonsense how This matters how These new CPUs mean something to someone, but certainly an audience of around 100 people. Globally. When most people used 1060 GPUs, how many are excited to learn about CPUs that have features and specs that nobody in their right mind would ever need or care about. Great that you cover such nonsense. If you didn't, who would Good luck on the affiliate income.
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Kairi_97
Currently running an Intel 9600KF with a RTX3080 and poor 2133Mhz RAM.
I have an ITX Build and want to keep my case so I bought a Asus B650E-I, 7800X3D and RAM 6000mHz 30CL (EXPO) yesterday. Could not wait any longer for the upgrade. Hopefully I can upgrade in 3-4 Years to an even better CPU and than finally also a new GPU running with PCIE gen5.
I will definitely check how the 9700X is performing
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Currently running an Intel 9600KF with a RTX3080 and poor 2133Mhz RAM.
I have an ITX Build and want to keep my case so I bought a Asus B650E-I, 7800X3D and RAM 6000mHz 30CL (EXPO) yesterday. Could not wait any longer for the upgrade. Hopefully I can upgrade in 3-4 Years to an even better CPU and than finally also a new GPU running with PCIE gen5.
I will definitely check how the 9700X is performing
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MR-vg7yn
I'm sorry, but in my opinion, the longevity of the socket gets _way_ too much focus. You people do realize that that is pretty much _only_ relevant to enthusiasts, right The vast majority of the market just does not upgrade their CPU every two or three years.
Yeah, it's nice AMD sticks to their socket for several generations, but I wonder if it holds them back every now and then.
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I'm sorry, but in my opinion, the longevity of the socket gets _way_ too much focus. You people do realize that that is pretty much _only_ relevant to enthusiasts, right The vast majority of the market just does not upgrade their CPU every two or three years.
Yeah, it's nice AMD sticks to their socket for several generations, but I wonder if it holds them back every now and then.
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Meditations2024
It'll be interesting to see how they compare to Intel's next iterations on their own more advanced nodes. TSMC will not be the sole fab with leading processes for much longer, although I believe their 3D V-Cache solution is unique to TSMC, at least for now.
I currently have a 5800X, so the next generation of CPU's will probably be sufficient to warrant an upgrade.
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It'll be interesting to see how they compare to Intel's next iterations on their own more advanced nodes. TSMC will not be the sole fab with leading processes for much longer, although I believe their 3D V-Cache solution is unique to TSMC, at least for now.
I currently have a 5800X, so the next generation of CPU's will probably be sufficient to warrant an upgrade.
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charackthe
Things are getting too complicated for me. I was originally going to wait for the new Intels or get a 14900K. Then the issues surfaced with 13th and 14th gen Intels.
I then planned to get a 7950X3D but the new AMDs are coming out. Then I learn that the 3D variants won't come out yet.
I don't know what to do. Get the new Intel, new AMD or get the previous 7950X3D.
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Things are getting too complicated for me. I was originally going to wait for the new Intels or get a 14900K. Then the issues surfaced with 13th and 14th gen Intels.
I then planned to get a 7950X3D but the new AMDs are coming out. Then I learn that the 3D variants won't come out yet.
I don't know what to do. Get the new Intel, new AMD or get the previous 7950X3D.
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eggnogsaber
Are these CPU's going to start degrading with these tiny transistors I'm used to CPU's being the last thing to ever really fail in PC's, but recently, I've seen them failing more, and hearing a lot about CPU failures in the industry. I heard from one commentator that at 5nm and smaller, transistor degredation becomes more likely. I'd love advice on that. Thanks!
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Are these CPU's going to start degrading with these tiny transistors I'm used to CPU's being the last thing to ever really fail in PC's, but recently, I've seen them failing more, and hearing a lot about CPU failures in the industry. I heard from one commentator that at 5nm and smaller, transistor degredation becomes more likely. I'd love advice on that. Thanks!
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aperson7624
Re: changing thermal sensor locations. Isn't this a bad thing Silicon that gets too hot degrades. Would this not lead to an Intel type situation where the CPUs slowly kill themselves unless you run them with such intense cooling that they never get above, maybe, 50C or something (assuming a 20C delta for the 'hottest' spots that don't get reported in software).
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Re: changing thermal sensor locations. Isn't this a bad thing Silicon that gets too hot degrades. Would this not lead to an Intel type situation where the CPUs slowly kill themselves unless you run them with such intense cooling that they never get above, maybe, 50C or something (assuming a 20C delta for the 'hottest' spots that don't get reported in software).
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Penfolduk001
Whilst AMD has been good with the longevity of sockets so far, I wouldn't want them to stretch it by compromising significant performance gains.
There's also some signs Intel might stretch sockets life in future. I suspect Intel was getting away with such frequent changes as the only kid on the block. Plus it kept their own fabs in use.
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Whilst AMD has been good with the longevity of sockets so far, I wouldn't want them to stretch it by compromising significant performance gains.
There's also some signs Intel might stretch sockets life in future. I suspect Intel was getting away with such frequent changes as the only kid on the block. Plus it kept their own fabs in use.
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gamersnexus
I've bought AMD and Intel chips in my life, but I have always cheered for AMD and have always been happier with AMD chips. Having said that, I can't stand this Zen 5 hype cycle anymore. Stop teasing the damn thing. I don't care about AMD claims or some leaked benchmarks. Just nudge me when it's actually here or at least fully reviewed.
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I've bought AMD and Intel chips in my life, but I have always cheered for AMD and have always been happier with AMD chips. Having said that, I can't stand this Zen 5 hype cycle anymore. Stop teasing the damn thing. I don't care about AMD claims or some leaked benchmarks. Just nudge me when it's actually here or at least fully reviewed.
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