The Framework Desktop Is An Interesting Take On SFF
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Date: 2025-02-27
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Comments and reviews: 20
JasonB808
Framework laptop is cool because parts are replaceable. I doubt they needed to make a desktop though. There are a lot of Mini PC that are smaller than that already. The Framework Desktop uses proprietary motherboard that has CPU and RAM soldered on to it. You can replace the SSD but that’s about it. I have a Minisforum Mini PC that I put my own SSD and Ram into it. The Framework Desktop doesn’t support discrete GPUs. Even though its APU has 40 compute units making it about as powerful as a 7700s GPU. You can’t upgrade it to a more powerful GPU. That Minisforum I bought technically only supports USB 4.0 and Thunderbolt 4 eGPUs. However it does have two PCie NVME slots. Which means I can use a PCI-E 4.0 NVME to Oculink adapter on the second slot and get a Oculink dock to work with it.
But even without all that, if there was no shortage of decent GPUs at MSRP and not Scalpflated, I could easily build the worlds most powerful Super SFF gaming PC using a case that is smaller than most eGPU docks.
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Framework laptop is cool because parts are replaceable. I doubt they needed to make a desktop though. There are a lot of Mini PC that are smaller than that already. The Framework Desktop uses proprietary motherboard that has CPU and RAM soldered on to it. You can replace the SSD but that’s about it. I have a Minisforum Mini PC that I put my own SSD and Ram into it. The Framework Desktop doesn’t support discrete GPUs. Even though its APU has 40 compute units making it about as powerful as a 7700s GPU. You can’t upgrade it to a more powerful GPU. That Minisforum I bought technically only supports USB 4.0 and Thunderbolt 4 eGPUs. However it does have two PCie NVME slots. Which means I can use a PCI-E 4.0 NVME to Oculink adapter on the second slot and get a Oculink dock to work with it.
But even without all that, if there was no shortage of decent GPUs at MSRP and not Scalpflated, I could easily build the worlds most powerful Super SFF gaming PC using a case that is smaller than most eGPU docks.
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Aurora12488
Guys, since desktops are already modular, there's not much for Framework to add as far as modularity goes. But them using a standard mini ITX motherboard for the Strix Halo APU is a nice touch, along with their usual I/O modules.
Do you want them to just not involve themselves with things other than laptops Is there something about modularity/repairability they could have done for the desktop that they didn't (and don't say upgradable RAM; they already said AMD engineering tried their best to make LPCAMM work but they couldn't achieve signal integrity).
This seems to be about the best product it could be, and at a decent price point as well.
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Guys, since desktops are already modular, there's not much for Framework to add as far as modularity goes. But them using a standard mini ITX motherboard for the Strix Halo APU is a nice touch, along with their usual I/O modules.
Do you want them to just not involve themselves with things other than laptops Is there something about modularity/repairability they could have done for the desktop that they didn't (and don't say upgradable RAM; they already said AMD engineering tried their best to make LPCAMM work but they couldn't achieve signal integrity).
This seems to be about the best product it could be, and at a decent price point as well.
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KeradSnake
Framework CEO Nirav Patel on the RAM situation on Strix Halo, at least for LPCAMM module anyway since it'd be much realistic for APU beast like this since they need all the memory speed and bandwidth (taken from Linus video btw): They asked AMD, in fact it was their first question about it - since they're Framework after all. One of AMD reps directed them to technical architecture peeps over at AMD, and they didn't say no. They go deep at explaining to Framework about it, and came to conclusion that LPCAMM on Strix Halo sadly messed up the signal integrity
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Framework CEO Nirav Patel on the RAM situation on Strix Halo, at least for LPCAMM module anyway since it'd be much realistic for APU beast like this since they need all the memory speed and bandwidth (taken from Linus video btw): They asked AMD, in fact it was their first question about it - since they're Framework after all. One of AMD reps directed them to technical architecture peeps over at AMD, and they didn't say no. They go deep at explaining to Framework about it, and came to conclusion that LPCAMM on Strix Halo sadly messed up the signal integrity
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Henk717
I find that desktop offensive. Framework could have stuck to their brand and at least have given people a normal formfactor that can fit parts. I get the CPU has limitations, fair. But wheres the room for a dedicated GPU upgrade Where is room for easily accessible expandable storage The design with the badges isn't a plus it just makes it look ugly and cheap. The swappable front modules are a joke compared to good IO.
With laptops you have a unique and very welcome selling point, but this desktop stucks compared to a maintainable tower.
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I find that desktop offensive. Framework could have stuck to their brand and at least have given people a normal formfactor that can fit parts. I get the CPU has limitations, fair. But wheres the room for a dedicated GPU upgrade Where is room for easily accessible expandable storage The design with the badges isn't a plus it just makes it look ugly and cheap. The swappable front modules are a joke compared to good IO.
With laptops you have a unique and very welcome selling point, but this desktop stucks compared to a maintainable tower.
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gamingallday9225
Pre-ordered with 128GB, damn impressive.
By the way why say so much nonsens. Some ex, you said AMD Ryzen AI 9 HX 370 is inferior to Snapdragon elite. It is not, in fact its a tiny bit faster but if anything in CPU measure they are almost equal with AMD being a bit better. And in GPU AMD crushes the Snapdragon easy!
Another ex, when you were showing the ports on the ITX box i heard you say there are multiple RJ45 or gigabit ports or something. That is not true as you even show it. There is just 1 port.
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Pre-ordered with 128GB, damn impressive.
By the way why say so much nonsens. Some ex, you said AMD Ryzen AI 9 HX 370 is inferior to Snapdragon elite. It is not, in fact its a tiny bit faster but if anything in CPU measure they are almost equal with AMD being a bit better. And in GPU AMD crushes the Snapdragon easy!
Another ex, when you were showing the ports on the ITX box i heard you say there are multiple RJ45 or gigabit ports or something. That is not true as you even show it. There is just 1 port.
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hamedhaghi
This wasn’t a major updatejust the introduction of a new motherboard for AMD CPUs on the FW13. The FW Desktop isn’t particularly exciting; we’ve had upgradeable desktop PCs for years. Meanwhile, the FW16 saw no updates at all. And honestly, who still uses a 12-inch laptop with massive bezels I expected Framework to focus on improving its laptop qualitybetter screens, sturdier builds, and overall refinement.
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This wasn’t a major updatejust the introduction of a new motherboard for AMD CPUs on the FW13. The FW Desktop isn’t particularly exciting; we’ve had upgradeable desktop PCs for years. Meanwhile, the FW16 saw no updates at all. And honestly, who still uses a 12-inch laptop with massive bezels I expected Framework to focus on improving its laptop qualitybetter screens, sturdier builds, and overall refinement.
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Max-pi7ri
A Modular Desktop that's less modular than a regular desktop
For the sake of putting in this one Processor they sacrificed removable Ram and Cpu and it's not even that small
A mini pc like a Lenovo has a smaller size and still has removable ram and is much cheaper
I like framework but they missed the mark on this one, it's just not a good product
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A Modular Desktop that's less modular than a regular desktop
For the sake of putting in this one Processor they sacrificed removable Ram and Cpu and it's not even that small
A mini pc like a Lenovo has a smaller size and still has removable ram and is much cheaper
I like framework but they missed the mark on this one, it's just not a good product
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kraftwels
i hope amd realize how much people want to put that chip in a desktop system.
i also hope they figure out how to make LPCamm modules work with it so we have upgradable memory.
lastly, Framework PLEASE sell this mainbord on it's own! as long as AM5 and Intel compatible coolers will work on it, you could build some awsome sff pcs with this thing
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i hope amd realize how much people want to put that chip in a desktop system.
i also hope they figure out how to make LPCamm modules work with it so we have upgradable memory.
lastly, Framework PLEASE sell this mainbord on it's own! as long as AM5 and Intel compatible coolers will work on it, you could build some awsome sff pcs with this thing
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deegarkie5598
13:01 FYI once larger SODIMM become available, you could install 128GB of RAM on the Framework 12's single RAM slot as long as someone makes it for laptops, and the memory controller doesnt crap the bed.
If Strix Halo had 8 desktop DIMMs instead of LPDDR it could have up to 1TB of RAM(far more likely to see 128GB sticks on the desktop)
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13:01 FYI once larger SODIMM become available, you could install 128GB of RAM on the Framework 12's single RAM slot as long as someone makes it for laptops, and the memory controller doesnt crap the bed.
If Strix Halo had 8 desktop DIMMs instead of LPDDR it could have up to 1TB of RAM(far more likely to see 128GB sticks on the desktop)
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ivayloi736
The desktop is adorable! But it's as modular as their laptops... If the next generation of these machines are a bit cheaper and with RDNA4 graphics, it will be great mini game PC.
I personally do not get who will use such small machines for AI, but according to AMD and Intel, there is a market there somewhere.
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The desktop is adorable! But it's as modular as their laptops... If the next generation of these machines are a bit cheaper and with RDNA4 graphics, it will be great mini game PC.
I personally do not get who will use such small machines for AI, but according to AMD and Intel, there is a market there somewhere.
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Obloms
I think its too expensive for what it offers. 256gb of memory bandwidth is not that amazing. There is also no CUDA support of course. As a comparison, Macbook Pro 4 with M4 Max and 400GB bandwidth only gets a small fraction of a say Nvidia 4090. That would be quite a bit faster vs this box.
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I think its too expensive for what it offers. 256gb of memory bandwidth is not that amazing. There is also no CUDA support of course. As a comparison, Macbook Pro 4 with M4 Max and 400GB bandwidth only gets a small fraction of a say Nvidia 4090. That would be quite a bit faster vs this box.
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oppa793
people complaining about ram not being upgradable probably don't understand that with these chips, that seems to be physically impossible even if they wanted to. so they'd have to go for another type of apu, at which point the whole ai/high vram workload usecase falls flat
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people complaining about ram not being upgradable probably don't understand that with these chips, that seems to be physically impossible even if they wanted to. so they'd have to go for another type of apu, at which point the whole ai/high vram workload usecase falls flat
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netiturtle
6:08 Case needs to be compatible with mini-ITX PCI-E slot. The motherboard does have a 4x slot, but no backplane for it. Upgradeability and proprietary don't work together, company chose to lock you into Framework for upgrades, which it pretty much what every OEM does
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6:08 Case needs to be compatible with mini-ITX PCI-E slot. The motherboard does have a 4x slot, but no backplane for it. Upgradeability and proprietary don't work together, company chose to lock you into Framework for upgrades, which it pretty much what every OEM does
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openbabel
Will the company be making an enterprise version running illumos distros for production professionals. So in terms of innovation, will framework be offering like Range Rover bespoke case design and build services through quality partners of personalized cases
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Will the company be making an enterprise version running illumos distros for production professionals. So in terms of innovation, will framework be offering like Range Rover bespoke case design and build services through quality partners of personalized cases
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farishanafiah8461
If Framework can make the desktop look like an Intel NUC Enthusiast or ASUS ROG NUC while still providing well-proven repairability, I'd be more than happy to buy one. Since I started using NUC, I don't see much appeal with tall tower PC anymore.
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If Framework can make the desktop look like an Intel NUC Enthusiast or ASUS ROG NUC while still providing well-proven repairability, I'd be more than happy to buy one. Since I started using NUC, I don't see much appeal with tall tower PC anymore.
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cordlesswire
so, this is new, aka not repurposing framework laptops innards meh. i thought you could pop innards of your old framework laptop and have it in desktop mode. i know they already have cases for that, but thought maybe this is a new iteration.
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so, this is new, aka not repurposing framework laptops innards meh. i thought you could pop innards of your old framework laptop and have it in desktop mode. i know they already have cases for that, but thought maybe this is a new iteration.
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michaeltatoy2388
they said that the signal integrity is the issue for the lack of expandable memory
what if they find a way to attatch a camm2 ram on the other side of the board, right at the under side of the cpu The distance will be very minimal.
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they said that the signal integrity is the issue for the lack of expandable memory
what if they find a way to attatch a camm2 ram on the other side of the board, right at the under side of the cpu The distance will be very minimal.
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JamesJones-zt2yx
Given all the options available for Framework laptop users, why are the Framework Desktop computers so limiting--you can choose the fan and which cutesy plastic badges you can attach to the front of the case!
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Given all the options available for Framework laptop users, why are the Framework Desktop computers so limiting--you can choose the fan and which cutesy plastic badges you can attach to the front of the case!
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_shreyash_anand
Love it. If you have the use for it, then this thing is absolutely amazing. 100 ish GB of VRAM for $2000 Just amazing stuff. Not convinced the $1100 base model is as good a value, but still not too bad
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Love it. If you have the use for it, then this thing is absolutely amazing. 100 ish GB of VRAM for $2000 Just amazing stuff. Not convinced the $1100 base model is as good a value, but still not too bad
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ighea
Lets be real here. The only special thing about this PC case thing is the high starting price. You can probably get better configurations for cheaper from other parties quite soon with better number of ports.
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Lets be real here. The only special thing about this PC case thing is the high starting price. You can probably get better configurations for cheaper from other parties quite soon with better number of ports.
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