Photoelectric Effect History: A Battle of Einstein vs. Lenard
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Date: 2022-12-27
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Comments and reviews: 20
James
First, the photoelectric effect theory is so logical and obvious, that you would think many physicists would have thought of it.
Second, it was, at the time, only a theory, a way of explaining an experimental results; and even an incomplete theory at that.
(for example, it did not explain, at the time, how light, being composed of photons, can undergo interference. Whereas positive and negative electric fields can cancel each other resulting in zero light intensity, then how do photons cancel each others)
Yet the Nobel committee deemed it appropriate to award a prize for the photoelectric effect theory.
Einstein, of course, deserved the Nobel prize, in fact, probably deserved two or three prizes on his work on special and general relativity.
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First, the photoelectric effect theory is so logical and obvious, that you would think many physicists would have thought of it.
Second, it was, at the time, only a theory, a way of explaining an experimental results; and even an incomplete theory at that.
(for example, it did not explain, at the time, how light, being composed of photons, can undergo interference. Whereas positive and negative electric fields can cancel each other resulting in zero light intensity, then how do photons cancel each others)
Yet the Nobel committee deemed it appropriate to award a prize for the photoelectric effect theory.
Einstein, of course, deserved the Nobel prize, in fact, probably deserved two or three prizes on his work on special and general relativity.
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Kaleb
There is a great mini-series called Genius (Season 1) all about Einstein. To be honest much of it is a kind of tabloid roast of Einstein on how he treated the women in his life, but hey, the guy was real focused and perhaps inconsiderate to other human beings around him. Anyway it's a great watch. I wish these dramas would be less about how terrible people were in the past and focus more on the science and discovery.
Also there is an excellent movie I recently watched called Einstein and Eddington (2008) staring David Tenet as Eddington and Andy Serkis as Einstein. Eddington is, of course, the guy took the very special photograph of the displaced light around a total solar eclipse. This was not easy because WWI was happening at the same time.
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There is a great mini-series called Genius (Season 1) all about Einstein. To be honest much of it is a kind of tabloid roast of Einstein on how he treated the women in his life, but hey, the guy was real focused and perhaps inconsiderate to other human beings around him. Anyway it's a great watch. I wish these dramas would be less about how terrible people were in the past and focus more on the science and discovery.
Also there is an excellent movie I recently watched called Einstein and Eddington (2008) staring David Tenet as Eddington and Andy Serkis as Einstein. Eddington is, of course, the guy took the very special photograph of the displaced light around a total solar eclipse. This was not easy because WWI was happening at the same time.
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Jan
Hi Kathy, please make a video about Einstein's actual achievements and ideas, I mean, explain:
- what parts of his theories were conceived by him and what parts were concepts already in the air of the science community.
- what parts of his relativity theories were proved wrong later, if any. Or were they 100% accurate?
- which of his ideas were still not accepted even after his fellows after being famous.
- what ideas were believed to be truth in his times but were proven wrong after his death.
- what was he working on at the time of his death.
I know he's one of the greatest brains of all time and I want to be clear of what exactly were his contributions to science.
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Hi Kathy, please make a video about Einstein's actual achievements and ideas, I mean, explain:
- what parts of his theories were conceived by him and what parts were concepts already in the air of the science community.
- what parts of his relativity theories were proved wrong later, if any. Or were they 100% accurate?
- which of his ideas were still not accepted even after his fellows after being famous.
- what ideas were believed to be truth in his times but were proven wrong after his death.
- what was he working on at the time of his death.
I know he's one of the greatest brains of all time and I want to be clear of what exactly were his contributions to science.
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kEYBAWD
Another superb video bringing it all to life as you bring the scientists to life. One scientist that I was sad you didn't mention -- you referred to him as a British scientist - is Arthur Eddington. A fascinating and important man. A torch bearer for Einstein (as well as an eclipse watcher for Einstein. He was no mean scientist either, especially in cosmology. He proposed that the energy of the stars came from fusion, and he was proved right. I wish there was an index of your videos, I can't always find one that follows another. The Lennard story is amazing and I shall have to watch the video again - pure drama. I am learning so much. Thank you.
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Another superb video bringing it all to life as you bring the scientists to life. One scientist that I was sad you didn't mention -- you referred to him as a British scientist - is Arthur Eddington. A fascinating and important man. A torch bearer for Einstein (as well as an eclipse watcher for Einstein. He was no mean scientist either, especially in cosmology. He proposed that the energy of the stars came from fusion, and he was proved right. I wish there was an index of your videos, I can't always find one that follows another. The Lennard story is amazing and I shall have to watch the video again - pure drama. I am learning so much. Thank you.
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GoCoyote
You do such an amazing job explaining the history of this wonderful topic. Pleas do not be afraid to go further into the math and science part of the history. This is a riveting show, and I cannot get enough! The blame and demonization of others is unfortunately still alive and well in our age. I find Lenard's views ironic, as humans have been acting as we are for a lot longer than we would like to admit, and there has never been a golden age. I believe we are all capable of being as intolerant and ignorant as the nazi's, and my biggest challenge is how to challenge intolerance and ignorance without being intolerant and ignorant.
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You do such an amazing job explaining the history of this wonderful topic. Pleas do not be afraid to go further into the math and science part of the history. This is a riveting show, and I cannot get enough! The blame and demonization of others is unfortunately still alive and well in our age. I find Lenard's views ironic, as humans have been acting as we are for a lot longer than we would like to admit, and there has never been a golden age. I believe we are all capable of being as intolerant and ignorant as the nazi's, and my biggest challenge is how to challenge intolerance and ignorance without being intolerant and ignorant.
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David
Supposing you just look at it and see how pumping photons in the photoelectric effect, Lasers and Masers, is equivalent to vibrating almost everything in a (string-like) way that inflates a bubble of wave-packaging, until it is dissociated-emitted from the bulk of resonance it had been associated with, then the mechanism of real-time relative-timing ratio-rates in wave-packaging formation of Logarithmic Time Duration Timing Conception, Black-body Superposition-point Superspin Singularity Universe, is the fundamental elemental quantization cause-effect that is QM-Time. , at a sum-of-all-histories glance?
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Supposing you just look at it and see how pumping photons in the photoelectric effect, Lasers and Masers, is equivalent to vibrating almost everything in a (string-like) way that inflates a bubble of wave-packaging, until it is dissociated-emitted from the bulk of resonance it had been associated with, then the mechanism of real-time relative-timing ratio-rates in wave-packaging formation of Logarithmic Time Duration Timing Conception, Black-body Superposition-point Superspin Singularity Universe, is the fundamental elemental quantization cause-effect that is QM-Time. , at a sum-of-all-histories glance?
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supermikeb
I heard Kathy feels like she connects better with her viewers by NOT reading a script while recording, so she memorizes her information and says it without her eyes moving. Nobody would probably ever notice this, but I think she just wants to be sure she is connecting with her audience as much as possible. Comments about her sound, lighting, hand motions, background music, name mispronunciations, and everything else will go away when people just read her book instead. The book will be out in about 15 weeks. It's complete now, but takes some time to publish it.
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I heard Kathy feels like she connects better with her viewers by NOT reading a script while recording, so she memorizes her information and says it without her eyes moving. Nobody would probably ever notice this, but I think she just wants to be sure she is connecting with her audience as much as possible. Comments about her sound, lighting, hand motions, background music, name mispronunciations, and everything else will go away when people just read her book instead. The book will be out in about 15 weeks. It's complete now, but takes some time to publish it.
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Donald
What a strange morale: Lenard felt that his discovery should be defended in stead of explained from another viewpoint, and think what would have happened if he had used these discoveries to make radio-telegraphy, or cathode ray sound-amplifiers and so on and on. He could have become very respected many ways.
So does this story show us that carreer moves in Physics (then - and maybe now) are hindered by oddities, weird circumstances, greedy capital (like Edison trying to squash alternate current, AC)?
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What a strange morale: Lenard felt that his discovery should be defended in stead of explained from another viewpoint, and think what would have happened if he had used these discoveries to make radio-telegraphy, or cathode ray sound-amplifiers and so on and on. He could have become very respected many ways.
So does this story show us that carreer moves in Physics (then - and maybe now) are hindered by oddities, weird circumstances, greedy capital (like Edison trying to squash alternate current, AC)?
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zambalic1
All your historical accounts of scientific discoveries are immensely interesting but this one struck a cord with me. For about six years I occupied a research a position with a large American company. During that I found that the competition among the research scientists was fierce, and without exaggeration a cut throat business without morals or scruples. A current example of such scientists is Dr. Fauci of the American Centre of Disease Control, the CDC.
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All your historical accounts of scientific discoveries are immensely interesting but this one struck a cord with me. For about six years I occupied a research a position with a large American company. During that I found that the competition among the research scientists was fierce, and without exaggeration a cut throat business without morals or scruples. A current example of such scientists is Dr. Fauci of the American Centre of Disease Control, the CDC.
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Vlad
I wonder if thought was given to the relation between the photo electric effect and the development if television. Charles Francis Jenkins and John Logie Baird developed and demonstrated television from the mid to late 1920's. The photoelectric effect was employed in the early television (mechanical) cameras. As the concept of television goes back to at least the 1870's the importance of the photoelectric effect would be grasped by early television pioneers.
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I wonder if thought was given to the relation between the photo electric effect and the development if television. Charles Francis Jenkins and John Logie Baird developed and demonstrated television from the mid to late 1920's. The photoelectric effect was employed in the early television (mechanical) cameras. As the concept of television goes back to at least the 1870's the importance of the photoelectric effect would be grasped by early television pioneers.
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Erik
I really love how you tie together science facts with the people who discovered them, with the general era, how wars, ideology and superstition (prejudice) influenced so many things. I can binge watch your videos for hours, never get tired or bored, even though I mostly know the science. Or maybe it is because my background knowledge, I am able to binge watch without problems. Hard to tell. Regardless, great videos, Kathy!
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I really love how you tie together science facts with the people who discovered them, with the general era, how wars, ideology and superstition (prejudice) influenced so many things. I can binge watch your videos for hours, never get tired or bored, even though I mostly know the science. Or maybe it is because my background knowledge, I am able to binge watch without problems. Hard to tell. Regardless, great videos, Kathy!
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BB
Einstein worked in a patent office and knew the rules. When you make an invention you have to prove how it works so the patent, credit and Nobel prize would could go to the first person that understood the principal. This was the time that professors would freely share their knowledge through letters to other scientist. Why would you being a science lover would be happy when Lenrad died?
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Einstein worked in a patent office and knew the rules. When you make an invention you have to prove how it works so the patent, credit and Nobel prize would could go to the first person that understood the principal. This was the time that professors would freely share their knowledge through letters to other scientist. Why would you being a science lover would be happy when Lenrad died?
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Neil
Hi Kathy, another cool vid, but what is the answer to your own question? Why did Einstein win for the Photo Electric effect? May I suggest that the resolution of the timeline of story telling detail should be much finer at about 14: 30 to 15: 00? That is really the crux of the opening question in the description paragraph.
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Hi Kathy, another cool vid, but what is the answer to your own question? Why did Einstein win for the Photo Electric effect? May I suggest that the resolution of the timeline of story telling detail should be much finer at about 14: 30 to 15: 00? That is really the crux of the opening question in the description paragraph.
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LadyAnuB
Kathy,
Did Lenard's views on race change over his life or was he born or instilled with these views?
Lenard believed in the aether in spite of the Michelson-Morley experimental failure?
So it was Lenard's doing that prevented Einstein from winning a Noble for Relativity, special or general.
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Kathy,
Did Lenard's views on race change over his life or was he born or instilled with these views?
Lenard believed in the aether in spite of the Michelson-Morley experimental failure?
So it was Lenard's doing that prevented Einstein from winning a Noble for Relativity, special or general.
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ZelosZelo
innit horrible how someone with influence will effect something as important as science, believing in their own opinion so much its like a horse blinder and they dont realize their reasons are just selfish and hateful or see how they are causing harm to everyone.
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innit horrible how someone with influence will effect something as important as science, believing in their own opinion so much its like a horse blinder and they dont realize their reasons are just selfish and hateful or see how they are causing harm to everyone.
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Bob
Your videos on the history of physics have really piqued my interest in the scientific intrigues and dramas that played out both in public and behind the scenes during these turbulent times of the 20th century. I'm avidly ingesting your extensive catalog. Thank you!
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Your videos on the history of physics have really piqued my interest in the scientific intrigues and dramas that played out both in public and behind the scenes during these turbulent times of the 20th century. I'm avidly ingesting your extensive catalog. Thank you!
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Ricardo
It is so much easier to remember facts, new words & concepts when they are tied to the people Who struggled to understand them & that is the service you are doing us all dear Kathy. Thank you for BEING YOU. I really appreciate you and your work!
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It is so much easier to remember facts, new words & concepts when they are tied to the people Who struggled to understand them & that is the service you are doing us all dear Kathy. Thank you for BEING YOU. I really appreciate you and your work!
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Richard
I imagine a scientist to be a rational thinking person, otherwise how could you do science. I find it interesting to see how rational thinking changes into radical thinking just by a change in the political climate.
Scary.
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I imagine a scientist to be a rational thinking person, otherwise how could you do science. I find it interesting to see how rational thinking changes into radical thinking just by a change in the political climate.
Scary.
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Joe
Why did Einstein get Nobel Prize for P/E and not S/R? What was Lorentz claim that Einstein didnt develop S/R, but it was Poincare?
Einstein was an important figure, no doubt. So not questioning that. Just what is the history.
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Why did Einstein get Nobel Prize for P/E and not S/R? What was Lorentz claim that Einstein didnt develop S/R, but it was Poincare?
Einstein was an important figure, no doubt. So not questioning that. Just what is the history.
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Sid
But what is the Higgs Field if not a sort of ether, which was necessary to complete what is known as the Standard Model of particle physics? To be fair, this was not really discovered until after Einstein's death. Just sayin'.
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But what is the Higgs Field if not a sort of ether, which was necessary to complete what is known as the Standard Model of particle physics? To be fair, this was not really discovered until after Einstein's death. Just sayin'.
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