Rivian's Line Cutting Problem Not The Start Of A YouTube War.
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Date: 2022-07-29
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Comments and reviews: 14
Bill
From the time they announced the inflated IPO price, and even that process was a bit hinkey, to the Laura Schwab lawsuit, that predicted the (mishandled) price increase, to the ongoing production problems, to the muddled and late site search for a factory, Rivian's management has stumbled and seemed incompetent and unprepared.
Designing a great product requires one set of skills. Growing and running an automotive manufacturer requires other totally different skills. Rivian's lack of experience at the top clearly shows in their missteps. For Rivian to be laying off people today because, they say, they can't raise enough money is utterly laughable when they have 17 Billion in cash on hand. Building an automotive factory costs 3-5 billion. Rivian can't raise more yet because of how badly they burned people with the IPO and how terribly the company has been mismanaged.
The line-jumping and how it has been allowed to fester is just another symptom of a company with ineffective leadership and no real plan for how to move forward. It's tragic to watch this for reasons beyond Rivian itself. Customers, investors, and the public at large will walk away with negative feelings, not only about this company, but potentially about the other new manufacturers and EVs themselves.
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From the time they announced the inflated IPO price, and even that process was a bit hinkey, to the Laura Schwab lawsuit, that predicted the (mishandled) price increase, to the ongoing production problems, to the muddled and late site search for a factory, Rivian's management has stumbled and seemed incompetent and unprepared.
Designing a great product requires one set of skills. Growing and running an automotive manufacturer requires other totally different skills. Rivian's lack of experience at the top clearly shows in their missteps. For Rivian to be laying off people today because, they say, they can't raise enough money is utterly laughable when they have 17 Billion in cash on hand. Building an automotive factory costs 3-5 billion. Rivian can't raise more yet because of how badly they burned people with the IPO and how terribly the company has been mismanaged.
The line-jumping and how it has been allowed to fester is just another symptom of a company with ineffective leadership and no real plan for how to move forward. It's tragic to watch this for reasons beyond Rivian itself. Customers, investors, and the public at large will walk away with negative feelings, not only about this company, but potentially about the other new manufacturers and EVs themselves.
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Bradley
From what I have gathered is that Rivian is simply building batches of truck with a certain spec and color (for speed and simplicity. Then matching them as closely to pre-order people's spec in an certain areas of the country. You can then opt to take it, or pass. If you pass, then wait for one that matches your pre-purchase spec. Now Rivian might have a truck that was passed on by a pre-order person(s) that they can be unloaded to current price order holder. Therefore, Rivian can make money on that truck, versus break even or loss money on it. They might be trying to capture market value for their truck. Someone who got the truck at or near the original launch price can easily flip that truck for a big profit! No good deed goes unpunished. Maybe I can get an R1S sooner than later.
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From what I have gathered is that Rivian is simply building batches of truck with a certain spec and color (for speed and simplicity. Then matching them as closely to pre-order people's spec in an certain areas of the country. You can then opt to take it, or pass. If you pass, then wait for one that matches your pre-purchase spec. Now Rivian might have a truck that was passed on by a pre-order person(s) that they can be unloaded to current price order holder. Therefore, Rivian can make money on that truck, versus break even or loss money on it. They might be trying to capture market value for their truck. Someone who got the truck at or near the original launch price can easily flip that truck for a big profit! No good deed goes unpunished. Maybe I can get an R1S sooner than later.
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Collective
It is such a new company I'm surprised everyone is falling on themselves to order. I'd cancel out of principal since they are playing favorites. this is the kind of mess usually reserved for Ferrari and other brands full of themselves. On paying over MSRP, people please stop doing it! It doesn't matter the car or technology. The more we do it, those more opportunistic dealers will charge. Personally every dealer that's ever quoted even a penny over MSRP is blacklisted from any future business with us. It doesn't matter if the car I want is right on their lot. Don't encourage predatory behaviour. Supply always catches up and you'll be left holding the bag. Also if you crash your over priced vehicle or need to trade it, good luck getting your money back.
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It is such a new company I'm surprised everyone is falling on themselves to order. I'd cancel out of principal since they are playing favorites. this is the kind of mess usually reserved for Ferrari and other brands full of themselves. On paying over MSRP, people please stop doing it! It doesn't matter the car or technology. The more we do it, those more opportunistic dealers will charge. Personally every dealer that's ever quoted even a penny over MSRP is blacklisted from any future business with us. It doesn't matter if the car I want is right on their lot. Don't encourage predatory behaviour. Supply always catches up and you'll be left holding the bag. Also if you crash your over priced vehicle or need to trade it, good luck getting your money back.
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Howard
I have a 2019 reservation and was on may/June delivery, was contacted by a guide in April but due to my state offering big rebate on EV purchases after 7/1 I asked to delay until then. No problem I was told and now at end of July I feel I was put at end of the line. My guide rarely responds to my inquiries and when he does I am promised an invite to Rivian shop to pick out an R1T close to my spec but in production. No invite ever sent and guide does not respond. I might be forced to cancel if I can t get by end of September. Bottom line Rivian is in demand now but at some point they will be another car company looking for sales and people like me that are left with less than a warm and fuzzy feeling will remember.
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I have a 2019 reservation and was on may/June delivery, was contacted by a guide in April but due to my state offering big rebate on EV purchases after 7/1 I asked to delay until then. No problem I was told and now at end of July I feel I was put at end of the line. My guide rarely responds to my inquiries and when he does I am promised an invite to Rivian shop to pick out an R1T close to my spec but in production. No invite ever sent and guide does not respond. I might be forced to cancel if I can t get by end of September. Bottom line Rivian is in demand now but at some point they will be another car company looking for sales and people like me that are left with less than a warm and fuzzy feeling will remember.
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sanjay
Yes I have heard of the line cutting and one of the reasons is price/profits. If someone preordered last year at original pricing and someone else reserved recently at current pricing it s ok for Rivian to deliver the trucks at current pricing to start cutting into their losses. If someone is willing to pay 20% more to get theirs sooner than someone who can wait a lil longer for original pricing then that s a good business move. The more original price holders cancel because of delays that also pushes up full price payers closer to the front thus more profit for Rivian. Otherwise they would take years to start cutting their losses by fulfilling lower priced trucks. I waited over 3 years for mine.
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Yes I have heard of the line cutting and one of the reasons is price/profits. If someone preordered last year at original pricing and someone else reserved recently at current pricing it s ok for Rivian to deliver the trucks at current pricing to start cutting into their losses. If someone is willing to pay 20% more to get theirs sooner than someone who can wait a lil longer for original pricing then that s a good business move. The more original price holders cancel because of delays that also pushes up full price payers closer to the front thus more profit for Rivian. Otherwise they would take years to start cutting their losses by fulfilling lower priced trucks. I waited over 3 years for mine.
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Bill
I don't know the specifics for Kyle but as a person with an order and deposit placed with Rivian I believe there may be a valid explanation. A while back I received an e-mail from Rivian explaining their manufacturing principles. They try to schedule batch runs so as to optimize the production time. This results in some vehicles being assembled that are not exactly what remains to produce in the order file. They may be a close proximity but not exact so they are not predestined to anyone. If someone with an existing order waiting to be filled is willing to change their spec to one of these vehicles they can move ahead on the line and take delivery. This I what I suspect happened in Kyle's case.
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I don't know the specifics for Kyle but as a person with an order and deposit placed with Rivian I believe there may be a valid explanation. A while back I received an e-mail from Rivian explaining their manufacturing principles. They try to schedule batch runs so as to optimize the production time. This results in some vehicles being assembled that are not exactly what remains to produce in the order file. They may be a close proximity but not exact so they are not predestined to anyone. If someone with an existing order waiting to be filled is willing to change their spec to one of these vehicles they can move ahead on the line and take delivery. This I what I suspect happened in Kyle's case.
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naveenthemachine
I would think that in general
Automotive journalists get the highest priority since they re journalists and well known. They can use their influencing techniques on manufacturers and put them on their hands and knees. As in you know who I am? I m Alex of Alex on autos. Any chance you can get me my lightning order sooner? Oh you can t? What a shame mic drop. Then you walk away and scare ford into thinking oh no. Alex may end up refusing to review fords. Then later, Ok Alex. We got great news. We were able to move you up the queue to getting your lightning tomorrow afternoon. So please continue to review and drive our products
Idk something like that. I really don t know
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I would think that in general
Automotive journalists get the highest priority since they re journalists and well known. They can use their influencing techniques on manufacturers and put them on their hands and knees. As in you know who I am? I m Alex of Alex on autos. Any chance you can get me my lightning order sooner? Oh you can t? What a shame mic drop. Then you walk away and scare ford into thinking oh no. Alex may end up refusing to review fords. Then later, Ok Alex. We got great news. We were able to move you up the queue to getting your lightning tomorrow afternoon. So please continue to review and drive our products
Idk something like that. I really don t know
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Richard
I agree that given the chance I might jump the line, and I agree that Rivian should not be doing allowing it ESPECIALLY with select auto reporters. The are getting TONS of positive press from all over from their press loaners, they do not need to let Kyle or anyone else jump the very long line and screw long-term order holders. Do you think Kyle will really do anything but shill for Rivian now? And other line jumpers? They owe Rivian now. At a minimum it's a bad look, and at worst it's an attempt by Rivian to curry favor with certain members of the auto press.
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I agree that given the chance I might jump the line, and I agree that Rivian should not be doing allowing it ESPECIALLY with select auto reporters. The are getting TONS of positive press from all over from their press loaners, they do not need to let Kyle or anyone else jump the very long line and screw long-term order holders. Do you think Kyle will really do anything but shill for Rivian now? And other line jumpers? They owe Rivian now. At a minimum it's a bad look, and at worst it's an attempt by Rivian to curry favor with certain members of the auto press.
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Don
Seems Rivian lacks common sense. Remember their giant pricing fiasco a few months back. What I. Q. level did the person who came up with that plan have? Does Rivian hire elementary school drop outs to run things? Letting someone cut in line to get a truck ahead of a reservation holder is just another sign that the drop out still works there!
And NO, I don't let the line cutters off the hook. For them to even ask shows they have no class at all and less morals. If they paid the same price as a reservation holder instead of the new price it might even be fraud.
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Seems Rivian lacks common sense. Remember their giant pricing fiasco a few months back. What I. Q. level did the person who came up with that plan have? Does Rivian hire elementary school drop outs to run things? Letting someone cut in line to get a truck ahead of a reservation holder is just another sign that the drop out still works there!
And NO, I don't let the line cutters off the hook. For them to even ask shows they have no class at all and less morals. If they paid the same price as a reservation holder instead of the new price it might even be fraud.
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Alan
It s wrong to skip reservation holders, the automaker is effectively extending their no interest loan on the deposit. I do think other automakers at least help influential reviewers get vehicles first but I can t say for sure that they jumped the line. I m thinking of TFL with the TRX where the automaker made extra effort to get the car from the factory to a dealer in Michigan at the end of the year. I doubt RAM would have made that effort for a normal buyer.
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It s wrong to skip reservation holders, the automaker is effectively extending their no interest loan on the deposit. I do think other automakers at least help influential reviewers get vehicles first but I can t say for sure that they jumped the line. I m thinking of TFL with the TRX where the automaker made extra effort to get the car from the factory to a dealer in Michigan at the end of the year. I doubt RAM would have made that effort for a normal buyer.
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Roman
The Rivian is great, but it is clearly going through growing pains right now. While I admire the vehicles, I'll wait until the R2 lineup starts coming down the assembly line before I consider getting one. So maybe I'll end up with the Scout SUV or the Kia EV9/ Hyundai Ioniq 7 instead of the R1S. Waiting 6 months for a vehicle is understandable. Anything more than that I'd rather wait for things to get fleshed out.
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The Rivian is great, but it is clearly going through growing pains right now. While I admire the vehicles, I'll wait until the R2 lineup starts coming down the assembly line before I consider getting one. So maybe I'll end up with the Scout SUV or the Kia EV9/ Hyundai Ioniq 7 instead of the R1S. Waiting 6 months for a vehicle is understandable. Anything more than that I'd rather wait for things to get fleshed out.
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Scott
Stuff like this happens all the time, and not just with car companies. If you want to stick with car companies doing this ask the guys from TFL how they were the first in the country to get an TRX. No doubt they weren t the first to configure one and place a deposit with a dealer. Again, stuff like that happens in everyday life and Rivian just happened to get called out on the practice.
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Stuff like this happens all the time, and not just with car companies. If you want to stick with car companies doing this ask the guys from TFL how they were the first in the country to get an TRX. No doubt they weren t the first to configure one and place a deposit with a dealer. Again, stuff like that happens in everyday life and Rivian just happened to get called out on the practice.
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Blake
People who order the top trim level Lightnings (Lariat, Platinum) are line cutting, by Ford, in front of those who order the Pro or XLT. Then, the dealerships will be allowed to line cut in front of the people who made reservations-- Ford is sending half of production to dealers directly and allow them to mark up however they want, then the other half will be order fulfillments.
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People who order the top trim level Lightnings (Lariat, Platinum) are line cutting, by Ford, in front of those who order the Pro or XLT. Then, the dealerships will be allowed to line cut in front of the people who made reservations-- Ford is sending half of production to dealers directly and allow them to mark up however they want, then the other half will be order fulfillments.
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212driller
My father has been waiting for his rivian for a very long time. They have been prioritizing Americans over Canadians regardless of preorder time. They also tried to increase his pre-order price before backpeddling when he gave them heck about it. He will likely sell it for profit when he gets it and have nothing to do with them again. I don't blame him.
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My father has been waiting for his rivian for a very long time. They have been prioritizing Americans over Canadians regardless of preorder time. They also tried to increase his pre-order price before backpeddling when he gave them heck about it. He will likely sell it for profit when he gets it and have nothing to do with them again. I don't blame him.
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