Buick LeSabre: Customer Replaced ECM / No Start: The Final Diagnosis
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Date: 2020-08-05
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Comments and reviews: 10
torquewrench
ok time for me to add my two cents here. So ok my assesment is somebody had been doing repairs on this way before it came to Mr. O or Eric lol. Anyways id assume that the same person that tried to force wrong computer in is the same person who put the starter in. I run a mobile repair business and I see mistakes thathave been made in the past which have costed some customers into the thousands. Before Craigslist made its debut my business made roughly 5 times the profit and 5 times the amount of business. There are inexperienced mechanics out there stripping bolts and crossthreading them at an alarming rate. We all as wrenchers have done it but than we replace or repair bolts before we conclude repairs whereas many of these guys don't whichis messed up. LAST WEEK I THOUGHT ID HAD FINALLY SEEN IT ALL WHEN I HAD GONE TO A REPAIR WHERE SOMEONE HAD STUCK A WOODEN PEG INTO A FRONT CONTROL ARM BOLT HOLE RATHER THAN THE BOLT. THE CUSTOMER DIDN'T AND STIL DOESN'T REALIZE HOW CLOSE THEY CAME TO DEATH. WHAT IF THIS PERSON HAD GONE ON THE HWY INSTEAD OF CALLING ME BECAUSE THEY MISTRUSTED THE GUY WHO PUT THE CONTROL ARM IN BECAUSE THE MECHANIC DIDNT HAVE BASIC TOOLS. THERE IS NO EXCUSE. Anyways on the repair Eric is doing id bet whoever put the starter i to begin with put nut on starter hand tight than forgot to tighten or crossthreaded the nut. There is no reason to crank that nut down and brand new starters get ruined for that reason. Not to mention the next guy goes to loosen the nut 5 years down the road and the whole works spins+ breaks off.
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ok time for me to add my two cents here. So ok my assesment is somebody had been doing repairs on this way before it came to Mr. O or Eric lol. Anyways id assume that the same person that tried to force wrong computer in is the same person who put the starter in. I run a mobile repair business and I see mistakes thathave been made in the past which have costed some customers into the thousands. Before Craigslist made its debut my business made roughly 5 times the profit and 5 times the amount of business. There are inexperienced mechanics out there stripping bolts and crossthreading them at an alarming rate. We all as wrenchers have done it but than we replace or repair bolts before we conclude repairs whereas many of these guys don't whichis messed up. LAST WEEK I THOUGHT ID HAD FINALLY SEEN IT ALL WHEN I HAD GONE TO A REPAIR WHERE SOMEONE HAD STUCK A WOODEN PEG INTO A FRONT CONTROL ARM BOLT HOLE RATHER THAN THE BOLT. THE CUSTOMER DIDN'T AND STIL DOESN'T REALIZE HOW CLOSE THEY CAME TO DEATH. WHAT IF THIS PERSON HAD GONE ON THE HWY INSTEAD OF CALLING ME BECAUSE THEY MISTRUSTED THE GUY WHO PUT THE CONTROL ARM IN BECAUSE THE MECHANIC DIDNT HAVE BASIC TOOLS. THERE IS NO EXCUSE. Anyways on the repair Eric is doing id bet whoever put the starter i to begin with put nut on starter hand tight than forgot to tighten or crossthreaded the nut. There is no reason to crank that nut down and brand new starters get ruined for that reason. Not to mention the next guy goes to loosen the nut 5 years down the road and the whole works spins+ breaks off.
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Dave
I appreciate this video from a first hand experience of punishing myself. My '04 Silverado needed a heater core, Which as you may know requires Dashboard removal! Quotes exceeding the trucks value. So of course, I decided to do it myself. Removing the dash requires considerable wiring disconnects. This all SEEMED simple enough, just time consuming! Well, after completion, I had a NO crank situation and power loss to many other random circuits. All fuses good! I had no choice but to retrace ALL my steps and see where I'd gone wrong. So after bringing her back to Stage 1, I found a smushed main body connector just under and next to the steering column. This connector used a type of swing over locking clamp that compresses the two together forcibly but with little effort. and it was obvious that the pins inside had mooshed and caused all the issues. Wires being so short, times and tempers matching! I decided to remove the very nearby main cabin fuse panel and get more slack to work on this connector and it's pins. At this point the 2200 quote for this heater core job seemed like a bargain! However, I was WAY too deep and HAD to complete this on my own. MORAL of story, Bring it in, It ain't just Nuts and bolts It's a whole lot of knowledge, that most of us don't have. But think we do! Thanks Eric for showing us exactly this with this video series. CARS aren't simple anymore! This Ain't my moms '69 Nova!
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I appreciate this video from a first hand experience of punishing myself. My '04 Silverado needed a heater core, Which as you may know requires Dashboard removal! Quotes exceeding the trucks value. So of course, I decided to do it myself. Removing the dash requires considerable wiring disconnects. This all SEEMED simple enough, just time consuming! Well, after completion, I had a NO crank situation and power loss to many other random circuits. All fuses good! I had no choice but to retrace ALL my steps and see where I'd gone wrong. So after bringing her back to Stage 1, I found a smushed main body connector just under and next to the steering column. This connector used a type of swing over locking clamp that compresses the two together forcibly but with little effort. and it was obvious that the pins inside had mooshed and caused all the issues. Wires being so short, times and tempers matching! I decided to remove the very nearby main cabin fuse panel and get more slack to work on this connector and it's pins. At this point the 2200 quote for this heater core job seemed like a bargain! However, I was WAY too deep and HAD to complete this on my own. MORAL of story, Bring it in, It ain't just Nuts and bolts It's a whole lot of knowledge, that most of us don't have. But think we do! Thanks Eric for showing us exactly this with this video series. CARS aren't simple anymore! This Ain't my moms '69 Nova!
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Adam
The infrared heat test is only 'fair' for testing if the cat is trying to light up, and stay lit. does nothing to tell about restrictions because the heat has nowhere to go, because obviously, the exhaust has nowhere to go. At that point, all you're testing is convection. Actual back pressure testing is the only way to go. However, even that is not 100% in proving the rest of the exhaust is clear. I had a 3. 1 Chevy that had a plugged cat, where part of it broke loose and plugged the resonator as well. I didn't know that at the time. My reading at the frt 02 sensor was 11psi at idle. 0, at the rear. OK slam a cat on it. Car was fine cold, but on hard excell hot, started to bogg. Just by having a partner whack the gas pedal, and my hand at the tailpipe, I could tell it still wasn't flowing that well, and now it had a rattle. Banging on the resonator with the car running, I found the rattle. Can't explain why it didn't do it with the melted cat, but it got a new resonator, and Whalla. My point is, to cover 1's bases, I always tell my customers that yes, it needs a cat, BUT I'm not 100% sure that everything downstream is ok internally. I have to start with what I do know.
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The infrared heat test is only 'fair' for testing if the cat is trying to light up, and stay lit. does nothing to tell about restrictions because the heat has nowhere to go, because obviously, the exhaust has nowhere to go. At that point, all you're testing is convection. Actual back pressure testing is the only way to go. However, even that is not 100% in proving the rest of the exhaust is clear. I had a 3. 1 Chevy that had a plugged cat, where part of it broke loose and plugged the resonator as well. I didn't know that at the time. My reading at the frt 02 sensor was 11psi at idle. 0, at the rear. OK slam a cat on it. Car was fine cold, but on hard excell hot, started to bogg. Just by having a partner whack the gas pedal, and my hand at the tailpipe, I could tell it still wasn't flowing that well, and now it had a rattle. Banging on the resonator with the car running, I found the rattle. Can't explain why it didn't do it with the melted cat, but it got a new resonator, and Whalla. My point is, to cover 1's bases, I always tell my customers that yes, it needs a cat, BUT I'm not 100% sure that everything downstream is ok internally. I have to start with what I do know.
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fictional25m
I worked for years in many shops some hired right out of voc I know they have to learn but exposing bad mechanics can be a good thing if no one checks there work or calls them out.
ive seen simple things turn into expensive nightmares and multi bay shops pass on bad diagnostics onto the customer they find a way to blame shift it back to the customer sometimes parts chasing is done on purpose by multi-bay name brand shops I left the industry because of it even had bad mechanics blame shift onto other mechanics in the same shop
I got tired of the crap working in those types of shops because if the bad mechanics can get away with pushing high flat rate hours on unneeded parts and the managers let customers get ripped off its just not right. i exposed the bad shops by name because if not who will. and the small shops that do honest work don't get recognition so expose them by name.
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I worked for years in many shops some hired right out of voc I know they have to learn but exposing bad mechanics can be a good thing if no one checks there work or calls them out.
ive seen simple things turn into expensive nightmares and multi bay shops pass on bad diagnostics onto the customer they find a way to blame shift it back to the customer sometimes parts chasing is done on purpose by multi-bay name brand shops I left the industry because of it even had bad mechanics blame shift onto other mechanics in the same shop
I got tired of the crap working in those types of shops because if the bad mechanics can get away with pushing high flat rate hours on unneeded parts and the managers let customers get ripped off its just not right. i exposed the bad shops by name because if not who will. and the small shops that do honest work don't get recognition so expose them by name.
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Crypto
I love your video's. I love the fact you took the time to give them the right diagnosis. I have a friend who had his durango that would crank but not start. After replacing a fuel pump due to a friends suggestion and a ecu due to a shops diagnostic, it would still not start. Me not being a mechanic, I'm actually a computer tech lol. I ended up fixing it out of pure luck. The error code was something about a battery overheat sensor. It was literally just a bad connector below the battery. How the mechanic messed up researching codes I will never know. But I hope you realize you could have been the difference between this person being without transportation for years and struggling while they save up money. I know I was with my friend he had almost given up.
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I love your video's. I love the fact you took the time to give them the right diagnosis. I have a friend who had his durango that would crank but not start. After replacing a fuel pump due to a friends suggestion and a ecu due to a shops diagnostic, it would still not start. Me not being a mechanic, I'm actually a computer tech lol. I ended up fixing it out of pure luck. The error code was something about a battery overheat sensor. It was literally just a bad connector below the battery. How the mechanic messed up researching codes I will never know. But I hope you realize you could have been the difference between this person being without transportation for years and struggling while they save up money. I know I was with my friend he had almost given up.
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Michael
Eric do you ever pull the backs off the solenoids & clean the 'poles' on your own cars to get 'em going again? (I know it's not worth doing on customers vehicles because of the liabilities involved but I've often done that on family/friends vehicles, I've even had them trying to 'claim warranty' for a free repair on an old starter)
Since I recently started making videos I really have to commend you on the quality & effort you go to (I know the difficulty involved dealing with glare, focus & lighting etc & I've only managed to do a few short ones on programming keys! ) I really admire your tenacity & I'd love to see (I'm sure everyone else would also) you do a video on you making a video if that makes sense? The production, so to speak.
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Eric do you ever pull the backs off the solenoids & clean the 'poles' on your own cars to get 'em going again? (I know it's not worth doing on customers vehicles because of the liabilities involved but I've often done that on family/friends vehicles, I've even had them trying to 'claim warranty' for a free repair on an old starter)
Since I recently started making videos I really have to commend you on the quality & effort you go to (I know the difficulty involved dealing with glare, focus & lighting etc & I've only managed to do a few short ones on programming keys! ) I really admire your tenacity & I'd love to see (I'm sure everyone else would also) you do a video on you making a video if that makes sense? The production, so to speak.
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Cindy
Trans went bad in my truck years ago. I was at the shop and it was late so I grabbed a dealer plate and put it on a ford we towed in and the customer gave it to us. I knew it ran and drove, everything worked so I figured it was my ride home. It was good until I got on the highway and it wouldn't break 25. I was just about home and a cop pulled me over for going so slow. It had gotten worse and I was down to like 15. He told me he thought for sure I was drunk. That was a plugged up cat. We ummm fixed the cat and used it at the shop for a parts runner for years
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Trans went bad in my truck years ago. I was at the shop and it was late so I grabbed a dealer plate and put it on a ford we towed in and the customer gave it to us. I knew it ran and drove, everything worked so I figured it was my ride home. It was good until I got on the highway and it wouldn't break 25. I was just about home and a cop pulled me over for going so slow. It had gotten worse and I was down to like 15. He told me he thought for sure I was drunk. That was a plugged up cat. We ummm fixed the cat and used it at the shop for a parts runner for years
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Ryan
The best way I have found to check for exhaust backpressure is to find a Oxygen sensor threaded adaptor (most have same thread pitch) to a hose nipple, and then vaccum line to a pressure gauge. Simply remove the upstream O2 sensor and install this finger tight. No drilling required. Now I will say, that's what we do in the South, where we don't have to worry much about rust. O2 sensor removal might be a bit more tricky in the rust belt.
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The best way I have found to check for exhaust backpressure is to find a Oxygen sensor threaded adaptor (most have same thread pitch) to a hose nipple, and then vaccum line to a pressure gauge. Simply remove the upstream O2 sensor and install this finger tight. No drilling required. Now I will say, that's what we do in the South, where we don't have to worry much about rust. O2 sensor removal might be a bit more tricky in the rust belt.
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rehab
As far as dependable cheap cars go these Buicks seem pretty bulletproof! I got one for free that had previously been thoroughly beat into the ground! I drove it for two years without issue until I donated it to charity! When I got it it had over 200k on it, ripped up interior, electric windows didn't work and the trunk wouldn't latch but it never gave me any trouble at all! I gave it away in the exact condition In which got it!
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As far as dependable cheap cars go these Buicks seem pretty bulletproof! I got one for free that had previously been thoroughly beat into the ground! I drove it for two years without issue until I donated it to charity! When I got it it had over 200k on it, ripped up interior, electric windows didn't work and the trunk wouldn't latch but it never gave me any trouble at all! I gave it away in the exact condition In which got it!
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autos
So on the starter I couldn't see everything but you were jumping the B terminal to the M terminal and had Mrs O turn the key to engage the Bendix right? So if you didn't have a helper you could in theory and if you had three hands use another vise grip or wrench and jumper from the B terminal or the vice grip to the S terminal to check the Bendix too?
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So on the starter I couldn't see everything but you were jumping the B terminal to the M terminal and had Mrs O turn the key to engage the Bendix right? So if you didn't have a helper you could in theory and if you had three hands use another vise grip or wrench and jumper from the B terminal or the vice grip to the S terminal to check the Bendix too?
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