![Wrathion Challenges Sabellian - All Cutscenes [WoW Dragonflight Beta]](https://i3.ytimg.com/vi/BnI9eN5Ej9I/maxresdefault.jpg)
Wrathion Challenges Sabellian - All Cutscenes [WoW Dragonflight Beta]
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Date: 2023-11-25
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Comments and reviews: 30
Jacob
ok, adding my two cents to the whole, Wrathion -prepared us for the legion thing by freeing Garrosh- and unfortunately, I'm gonna have to side with the people that disagree. Many people I see going with this argument is that we needed WoD to level up for legion, but in terms of the lore, that doesn't make much sense. Correct me if I'm wrong, but there isn't much support for leveling being an actual aspect to the story, yes there are level restrictions on quests, but that's on an individual level, not relevant to the strength of either faction. That, and the leveling system fluctuates so much that it can't sensibly be used as a meaningful measure of progression outside of gam mechanics. For example, right now, you level up to 10 on the starting isle or start at 10 for allied races, then can go straight to BFA content, where if we hold levels as pure measures of character power, means that current level ten characters that start in BFA canonically have the strength to push back the legion. Obviously this doesn't really fit, its more a framing device for leveling to make new players better understand the plot, but you get my point, the level number is a LOT more fluid in the story then some people think.
One better measure and better framing on our ability to take down ANY big bad in the story is in war logistics, clearing threats in each new zone so that our forces can push further and further into enemy territory, going through a zones storyline to deal with threats, gather resources and allies, and secure staging points for our forces. Even those leveling quests in each of those zones to -beef up- our power level to take on the main bad is more frequently framed less as a means to power up and more as a tactical move to lower our enemies power and resources and boost our own abilities. Think about most of the major raids in lore, the siege on the black temple was a -siege- by our forces while we slipped in a backdoor, on ice crown, we literally have an encampment of our combined forces giving us the support to take on the raid.
Ultimately, the central problem I have with this isn't so much that -WoD was needed- I have arguments against but I concede I can be wrong on that, but I emphatically deny that Wrathion take ANY credit for it, seeing how WoD wasn't the result of his careful planning, but the utter failure of it. Remember, Wrathion's original plan was to make the iron horde, or rather, an infinite iron horde then to use that horde to come to Azeroth's aid, and the second Garrosh gets free on Dranor, he kills the time dragon that could have made an infinite army, and then builds his forces not to fight the legion (although that's another weird problem, Garrosh musters this massive grand army, and instead of fighting the objectively greatest foe to all life including his own, he goes out of his way in vain glory to attack Azeroth in I guess payback. I get why, but its still really petty in hindsight) but instead he invades Azeroth, The EXACT opposite of Wrathions plans. Heck, it goes even further, remember, the point of his free Garrosh was to prepare for the legion, there was absolutely no part in the plan to actually summon the legion, so the fact that his actions lead to the legion invasion on Azeroth is counter to EVERY part of his plan. In essence, yes, we ultimately were able to fight back and end the threat of the legion, but none of how we did that was a part of Wrathions plan, we beat the legion not because of him, but in spite of him.
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ok, adding my two cents to the whole, Wrathion -prepared us for the legion thing by freeing Garrosh- and unfortunately, I'm gonna have to side with the people that disagree. Many people I see going with this argument is that we needed WoD to level up for legion, but in terms of the lore, that doesn't make much sense. Correct me if I'm wrong, but there isn't much support for leveling being an actual aspect to the story, yes there are level restrictions on quests, but that's on an individual level, not relevant to the strength of either faction. That, and the leveling system fluctuates so much that it can't sensibly be used as a meaningful measure of progression outside of gam mechanics. For example, right now, you level up to 10 on the starting isle or start at 10 for allied races, then can go straight to BFA content, where if we hold levels as pure measures of character power, means that current level ten characters that start in BFA canonically have the strength to push back the legion. Obviously this doesn't really fit, its more a framing device for leveling to make new players better understand the plot, but you get my point, the level number is a LOT more fluid in the story then some people think.
One better measure and better framing on our ability to take down ANY big bad in the story is in war logistics, clearing threats in each new zone so that our forces can push further and further into enemy territory, going through a zones storyline to deal with threats, gather resources and allies, and secure staging points for our forces. Even those leveling quests in each of those zones to -beef up- our power level to take on the main bad is more frequently framed less as a means to power up and more as a tactical move to lower our enemies power and resources and boost our own abilities. Think about most of the major raids in lore, the siege on the black temple was a -siege- by our forces while we slipped in a backdoor, on ice crown, we literally have an encampment of our combined forces giving us the support to take on the raid.
Ultimately, the central problem I have with this isn't so much that -WoD was needed- I have arguments against but I concede I can be wrong on that, but I emphatically deny that Wrathion take ANY credit for it, seeing how WoD wasn't the result of his careful planning, but the utter failure of it. Remember, Wrathion's original plan was to make the iron horde, or rather, an infinite iron horde then to use that horde to come to Azeroth's aid, and the second Garrosh gets free on Dranor, he kills the time dragon that could have made an infinite army, and then builds his forces not to fight the legion (although that's another weird problem, Garrosh musters this massive grand army, and instead of fighting the objectively greatest foe to all life including his own, he goes out of his way in vain glory to attack Azeroth in I guess payback. I get why, but its still really petty in hindsight) but instead he invades Azeroth, The EXACT opposite of Wrathions plans. Heck, it goes even further, remember, the point of his free Garrosh was to prepare for the legion, there was absolutely no part in the plan to actually summon the legion, so the fact that his actions lead to the legion invasion on Azeroth is counter to EVERY part of his plan. In essence, yes, we ultimately were able to fight back and end the threat of the legion, but none of how we did that was a part of Wrathions plan, we beat the legion not because of him, but in spite of him.
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Mr.
I think of all the Aspects, Alexstrasza was the one that was meant to be the Aspects' sole survivor. Malygos fell to despair before cloistering away in the Eye of Eternity, Neltharion was corrupted first and foremost, afflicted with the curse of flesh, and made susceptible to the Old God's corruption, Nozdormu will one day become Murozond, command the infinite dragonflight to try to rewrite Azeroth's history before being take down at the end of Time. And Ysera was claimed by death while defending what she treasured most, the emerald Dream. In the end, Yes, Kalecgos can perhaps reclaim Malygos' Aspect power, Wrathion or Sabellian can make the claim for the Black Aspect, and Merithria can succeed her mother for the Green aspect, but ultimately, Nozdormu is very likely to plunge the fate of the Aspects into chaos once more. The fight may end up between Murozond and Alexstrasza, the only 2 originals standing.
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I think of all the Aspects, Alexstrasza was the one that was meant to be the Aspects' sole survivor. Malygos fell to despair before cloistering away in the Eye of Eternity, Neltharion was corrupted first and foremost, afflicted with the curse of flesh, and made susceptible to the Old God's corruption, Nozdormu will one day become Murozond, command the infinite dragonflight to try to rewrite Azeroth's history before being take down at the end of Time. And Ysera was claimed by death while defending what she treasured most, the emerald Dream. In the end, Yes, Kalecgos can perhaps reclaim Malygos' Aspect power, Wrathion or Sabellian can make the claim for the Black Aspect, and Merithria can succeed her mother for the Green aspect, but ultimately, Nozdormu is very likely to plunge the fate of the Aspects into chaos once more. The fight may end up between Murozond and Alexstrasza, the only 2 originals standing.
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David
Wrathion's plan robbed us of three of azeroth's greatest heroes and leaders not to mention the hundreds if not thousands of lives lost in the war against the legion and set us on a path that would claim far more lives due to the events of The Battle For Azeroth and the Shadowlands campaigns. Wrathion also almost wiped out the black dragonflight from existence with his campaign of cruelty murdering the corrupted when there was a better alternative. He did what he thought was nessacary for his self proclaimed mission of the greater good but after so much death and destruction caused by him and his actions he is not the best choice to become the new black dragonflight aspect. If he were to become the new aspect of earth with that increase in status and power there is not telling how many more lives will be claimed or lands destroyed for his greater good.
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Wrathion's plan robbed us of three of azeroth's greatest heroes and leaders not to mention the hundreds if not thousands of lives lost in the war against the legion and set us on a path that would claim far more lives due to the events of The Battle For Azeroth and the Shadowlands campaigns. Wrathion also almost wiped out the black dragonflight from existence with his campaign of cruelty murdering the corrupted when there was a better alternative. He did what he thought was nessacary for his self proclaimed mission of the greater good but after so much death and destruction caused by him and his actions he is not the best choice to become the new black dragonflight aspect. If he were to become the new aspect of earth with that increase in status and power there is not telling how many more lives will be claimed or lands destroyed for his greater good.
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Benjamin
So we're framing the whole Wrathion bringing the Iron Horde to Azeroth, leading to Gul'dan coming to our world to helm the legion invasion, killing thousands of people including some of our greatest heroes like Vol'Jin, Varian, Tirion Fordring, etc, which all ended with a huge flipping sword stabbed into Azeroth, weakening her so that the God of Death could come to claim her soul as Wrathion doing a minor oopsie for the good of Azeroth?
Why isn't this guy dead yet? I'm sorry I don't see plunging a knife into the endboss as making up for setting the stage for several catastrophes, and I don't see how a cheeky flamboyant smile is enough character development to warrant us forgiving this asshole for what he's done. He's a spoiled brat who we should have killed a long time ago.
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So we're framing the whole Wrathion bringing the Iron Horde to Azeroth, leading to Gul'dan coming to our world to helm the legion invasion, killing thousands of people including some of our greatest heroes like Vol'Jin, Varian, Tirion Fordring, etc, which all ended with a huge flipping sword stabbed into Azeroth, weakening her so that the God of Death could come to claim her soul as Wrathion doing a minor oopsie for the good of Azeroth?
Why isn't this guy dead yet? I'm sorry I don't see plunging a knife into the endboss as making up for setting the stage for several catastrophes, and I don't see how a cheeky flamboyant smile is enough character development to warrant us forgiving this asshole for what he's done. He's a spoiled brat who we should have killed a long time ago.
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Wrath
I feel like everyone is making good points for both Wrathion and Sabellian because on the one hand; Wrathion does have the potential, drive and skills to be a great leader but he is too arrogant, reckless and young, on the other hand; Sabellian has the experience, resources and more support but he is too eager, seemingly close-minded and highly prone to inactivity. While Sabellian is probably the better choice both need to improve themselves before rushing into this, I feel like Ebyssian should get in on this action as he would make a good leader. If not then he can at least be a counselling voice for the Aspect and his potential successor no matter who becomes what.
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I feel like everyone is making good points for both Wrathion and Sabellian because on the one hand; Wrathion does have the potential, drive and skills to be a great leader but he is too arrogant, reckless and young, on the other hand; Sabellian has the experience, resources and more support but he is too eager, seemingly close-minded and highly prone to inactivity. While Sabellian is probably the better choice both need to improve themselves before rushing into this, I feel like Ebyssian should get in on this action as he would make a good leader. If not then he can at least be a counselling voice for the Aspect and his potential successor no matter who becomes what.
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ffarkasm
1: 20 and 2: 24 I'm not a native English speaker, but I think it is wrong. AFAIK, Wrathion is supposed to say -heritage- or -inheritance-, not -legacy-.
It is the same object from diffener viewpoint. If someone (for instance parents )leaves behind for their child, then from their point of view it is his/her legacy. But from the child's point of view it is heritage. If we say -the child's legacy-, that means that the child left behind something, not that the child inherited something.
So in this sense, that's Wrathion's heritage not his legacy. That' probably Neltharion/Deathwing's legacy.
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1: 20 and 2: 24 I'm not a native English speaker, but I think it is wrong. AFAIK, Wrathion is supposed to say -heritage- or -inheritance-, not -legacy-.
It is the same object from diffener viewpoint. If someone (for instance parents )leaves behind for their child, then from their point of view it is his/her legacy. But from the child's point of view it is heritage. If we say -the child's legacy-, that means that the child left behind something, not that the child inherited something.
So in this sense, that's Wrathion's heritage not his legacy. That' probably Neltharion/Deathwing's legacy.
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Justin
-Sabellian rallied us on Outland, not only saving us from death, but from the corruption that befell our kin. -
Um. No? Sabellian and those with him on Outland were already corrupted well before they got there. They even followed Deathwing there.
Not that Wrathion-s track record is much better with what he-s done as an uncorrupted dragon. And I get that since Outland was so far away from the Old Gods that the black Dragonflight there sort of mellowed out, that doesn-t make that statement any less false.
Unless he meant -saved from further corruption-. Then, sure, I guess.
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-Sabellian rallied us on Outland, not only saving us from death, but from the corruption that befell our kin. -
Um. No? Sabellian and those with him on Outland were already corrupted well before they got there. They even followed Deathwing there.
Not that Wrathion-s track record is much better with what he-s done as an uncorrupted dragon. And I get that since Outland was so far away from the Old Gods that the black Dragonflight there sort of mellowed out, that doesn-t make that statement any less false.
Unless he meant -saved from further corruption-. Then, sure, I guess.
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Happy
They are setting Wrathion up for something. Not sure what. But his hubris is always played up. Reminds me a bit of Illidan and Kael, leaders who have temper issues and enormous ambition and excessive pride. Illidan has many hero qualities but also antihero. I feel like that's the direction they want to take Wrathion in. I'm not sure that he's going to be Black Aspect, or if he is, if that's going to be any kind of smooth ride. They could always eventually go the buddy route and have them share power, if that is ok with Alex, but it might not be as fun.
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They are setting Wrathion up for something. Not sure what. But his hubris is always played up. Reminds me a bit of Illidan and Kael, leaders who have temper issues and enormous ambition and excessive pride. Illidan has many hero qualities but also antihero. I feel like that's the direction they want to take Wrathion in. I'm not sure that he's going to be Black Aspect, or if he is, if that's going to be any kind of smooth ride. They could always eventually go the buddy route and have them share power, if that is ok with Alex, but it might not be as fun.
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Hryzzo
I like the role of Sabellian to be stepping stone for wrathion being a leader. Let's be real, Wrathois is a leader with no followers and he needs convince the others why he should be the new leader. For that he should change his views and ways to earn the respect of the other black dragons. A really nice way for wrathoins character grow.
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I like the role of Sabellian to be stepping stone for wrathion being a leader. Let's be real, Wrathois is a leader with no followers and he needs convince the others why he should be the new leader. For that he should change his views and ways to earn the respect of the other black dragons. A really nice way for wrathoins character grow.
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Famous
I don't think Blizzard understands how war works. You can't 'prepare' for one war by devoting resources, soldiers, and time to fighting another. Nothing about Draenor or even Pandaria 'prepared' us for the Invasion better than literally quiet peace and time to recover from previous conflicts would have.
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I don't think Blizzard understands how war works. You can't 'prepare' for one war by devoting resources, soldiers, and time to fighting another. Nothing about Draenor or even Pandaria 'prepared' us for the Invasion better than literally quiet peace and time to recover from previous conflicts would have.
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Ricardo
Even tough the wiser dragon is def sabellian it was wrathion that did the real action on and for azeroth while Sabellion only sat in exile in outland and didnt bother to be world guardian untill the summon of the dragon isle. So even tough I dont think its wise now it def makes Wrathion the true heir
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Even tough the wiser dragon is def sabellian it was wrathion that did the real action on and for azeroth while Sabellion only sat in exile in outland and didnt bother to be world guardian untill the summon of the dragon isle. So even tough I dont think its wise now it def makes Wrathion the true heir
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Austin
Let's all be real, here. We know where this is going. Sabellian is the best for the for the Black Dragonflight, but Blizzard has built up Wrathion (in the wrong direction imo) too much for them to pull the title out from under him. Sabellian doesn't even have a unique model, for goodness sake.
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Let's all be real, here. We know where this is going. Sabellian is the best for the for the Black Dragonflight, but Blizzard has built up Wrathion (in the wrong direction imo) too much for them to pull the title out from under him. Sabellian doesn't even have a unique model, for goodness sake.
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Water
The problem would be solved if Ebonhorn/Ebyssian took control. He is wise, lived on Azeroth, aided the fight against the burning legion and has documented experience guiding others down the right path. His calm wisdom, without Sabellian's judginess or Wrathion's brashness, would be perfect
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The problem would be solved if Ebonhorn/Ebyssian took control. He is wise, lived on Azeroth, aided the fight against the burning legion and has documented experience guiding others down the right path. His calm wisdom, without Sabellian's judginess or Wrathion's brashness, would be perfect
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Kardel_VA
Sabellion deserves it hands down. He holds the title whilst Wrathion does his own independent thing. Better they work together honestly.
Aw, who am I kidding, they're gonna make Sabellion evil and Wrathion into the hero and justify his crappy actions yet again.
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Sabellion deserves it hands down. He holds the title whilst Wrathion does his own independent thing. Better they work together honestly.
Aw, who am I kidding, they're gonna make Sabellion evil and Wrathion into the hero and justify his crappy actions yet again.
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Balorak146
Hey Ebonhorn, do you maybe want to step in here and curbstomp these two idiots? Maybe grab Wrathion by his scruff and throw him into the sun for the crime of inheriting all of Deathwing's arrogance & wit and yet none of his common sense?
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Hey Ebonhorn, do you maybe want to step in here and curbstomp these two idiots? Maybe grab Wrathion by his scruff and throw him into the sun for the crime of inheriting all of Deathwing's arrogance & wit and yet none of his common sense?
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Aestholus
Wrathion is a child accepting no advice other than himself.
Directly casuing the ironhorde invasion of Azeroth and the legion invasion shortly after.
Yeah Id'rather take my old pal Sabellian from Outland than this brat.
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Wrathion is a child accepting no advice other than himself.
Directly casuing the ironhorde invasion of Azeroth and the legion invasion shortly after.
Yeah Id'rather take my old pal Sabellian from Outland than this brat.
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Skayth
the reality of the quest arc is gonna have Wrathion win over his Sabellian, and Sabellian somehow falter and turn evil. Even though, if you think about everything done in the past. Sabellian is the clear choice to choose.
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the reality of the quest arc is gonna have Wrathion win over his Sabellian, and Sabellian somehow falter and turn evil. Even though, if you think about everything done in the past. Sabellian is the clear choice to choose.
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Cavalcante
That's why ppl get sick of playing wow, every content creator play all the the lore on beta, and whe it came to live they're like -ohhh there's nothing new, where's the lore, c'mon where's the alt friendly things-
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That's why ppl get sick of playing wow, every content creator play all the the lore on beta, and whe it came to live they're like -ohhh there's nothing new, where's the lore, c'mon where's the alt friendly things-
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-1
I am so sick of Blizzar trying to justify every action and character. You know, it's okay that stories have bad guys. I had decided that I will return to WOW, but now I. just never mind. I''m deleting WOW again
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I am so sick of Blizzar trying to justify every action and character. You know, it's okay that stories have bad guys. I had decided that I will return to WOW, but now I. just never mind. I''m deleting WOW again
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LoreFreak
Any sign of hide or scale of the netherwing dragon in the comming expansion? Most of them with some black dragon blood in them would be interesting to see how they fit this dynamic. I love my netherwing.
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Any sign of hide or scale of the netherwing dragon in the comming expansion? Most of them with some black dragon blood in them would be interesting to see how they fit this dynamic. I love my netherwing.
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BeastMaster09
2: 18
Oh boy, here he goes again -
EDIT:
That cart riding segment is the greatest thing ever
-Titans, give me patience-
Yes, or else he-s gonna snap his little brother-s neck.
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2: 18
Oh boy, here he goes again -
EDIT:
That cart riding segment is the greatest thing ever
-Titans, give me patience-
Yes, or else he-s gonna snap his little brother-s neck.
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Serron
Amusing that he calls the Champions Mortals when the Dragonflights lost their immortality. Even more ironic when supposedly the Demon Hunters are Immortal because they have become mostly demons.
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Amusing that he calls the Champions Mortals when the Dragonflights lost their immortality. Even more ironic when supposedly the Demon Hunters are Immortal because they have become mostly demons.
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Blazindragon
I sure hope we get some cool things with Neltharaku and we learn more about what him and the Netherwing Dragonflight have been doing since Outland in this expansion like with Sabellian.
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I sure hope we get some cool things with Neltharaku and we learn more about what him and the Netherwing Dragonflight have been doing since Outland in this expansion like with Sabellian.
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Merik
If I did not have to pay, I would definitely want to experience this peer into a shadowed path. unfortunately, I cannot support what blizz has become. I'll have to see from outside this time
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If I did not have to pay, I would definitely want to experience this peer into a shadowed path. unfortunately, I cannot support what blizz has become. I'll have to see from outside this time
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Nick
My god I hate the voice acting of dragons/dracthyr when they-re not in human form - how does a being with draconic lungs and voice box sound so camp! Make a dragon sound like a dragon plz FFS
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My god I hate the voice acting of dragons/dracthyr when they-re not in human form - how does a being with draconic lungs and voice box sound so camp! Make a dragon sound like a dragon plz FFS
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Mattemattics
Feel like Sabellion-s going to go bad by the end. He seems too -justifiable. - Seems like they-re trying to draw players to him only for him to have a big betrayal at some point.
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Feel like Sabellion-s going to go bad by the end. He seems too -justifiable. - Seems like they-re trying to draw players to him only for him to have a big betrayal at some point.
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TheSko90
It should also be noted that with the deaths of Nefarian, Onyxia, and Deathwing himself Sabellian is probably the oldest living Black Dragon on the planet.
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It should also be noted that with the deaths of Nefarian, Onyxia, and Deathwing himself Sabellian is probably the oldest living Black Dragon on the planet.
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Voldr.
I would say what Wrathion did was questionable. Since he set Garrosh free and the orcs of Draenor still think to themselves that they must conquer Azeroth
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I would say what Wrathion did was questionable. Since he set Garrosh free and the orcs of Draenor still think to themselves that they must conquer Azeroth
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Space
I'm a bit disappointed in the dragon skins. wanted to really look like a dragon and walk on all fours lol (like a druid) Is there a tail swipe ability? -
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I'm a bit disappointed in the dragon skins. wanted to really look like a dragon and walk on all fours lol (like a druid) Is there a tail swipe ability? -
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M. A. DMatt6
Wrathion: -I know not from where you hail, friend, but I cannot fault such a timely arrival. -
Rogue with Fangs of the Father: -Bruh. -
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Wrathion: -I know not from where you hail, friend, but I cannot fault such a timely arrival. -
Rogue with Fangs of the Father: -Bruh. -
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