The Coolest Speakers are TOO PRICEY Let's Change that! (DIY or Buy)
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Date: 2025-01-14
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Comments and reviews: 20
mad-dog_gamer
You scared of cost about $50 per unit, how much would you charge for both your time to build it on to reduce out your equipment. When you add shipping from the manufacturer to the retail company that you purchased it from. while bearing in mind the time it took to design it and the fact that most likely it wasn't made completely by hand, and there was some manufacturing involved. how much do you think it should have cost you to buy one, complete without you having to build it yourself figuring a company would build large quantities of these at the same time it probably wouldn't cost $50 per unit. bearing in mind paying all of the employees at the factory and warehousing. how much do you think it should cost if Mass assembled, and how much it should cost from a small business owner that buys the parts and builds it themselves like you would. even taking the account that you would most likely sell direct to the customer if you made it yourself. you would have to pay to ship all the parts to you, the equipment that you had to buy originally and all of the maintenance on your equipment and the electricity as well as how much it costs to have your shop. I just figure for the designers expertise and everything and the manufacturing if it was mass produced the company taking $100 for the design and everything figuring it cost half as much to manufacture probably last but let's say $125. then the price that retail stores take. makes sense because most likely there was a wholesaler between the mass production company and the company you bought it from, everybody wants their peas. I understand if it was a small company and they were making them by hand, that it cost more to do it that way. a big company has more layers, and a small company has more expenses. so $250 makes sense. That doesn't mean it doesn't suck for the customer.
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You scared of cost about $50 per unit, how much would you charge for both your time to build it on to reduce out your equipment. When you add shipping from the manufacturer to the retail company that you purchased it from. while bearing in mind the time it took to design it and the fact that most likely it wasn't made completely by hand, and there was some manufacturing involved. how much do you think it should have cost you to buy one, complete without you having to build it yourself figuring a company would build large quantities of these at the same time it probably wouldn't cost $50 per unit. bearing in mind paying all of the employees at the factory and warehousing. how much do you think it should cost if Mass assembled, and how much it should cost from a small business owner that buys the parts and builds it themselves like you would. even taking the account that you would most likely sell direct to the customer if you made it yourself. you would have to pay to ship all the parts to you, the equipment that you had to buy originally and all of the maintenance on your equipment and the electricity as well as how much it costs to have your shop. I just figure for the designers expertise and everything and the manufacturing if it was mass produced the company taking $100 for the design and everything figuring it cost half as much to manufacture probably last but let's say $125. then the price that retail stores take. makes sense because most likely there was a wholesaler between the mass production company and the company you bought it from, everybody wants their peas. I understand if it was a small company and they were making them by hand, that it cost more to do it that way. a big company has more layers, and a small company has more expenses. so $250 makes sense. That doesn't mean it doesn't suck for the customer.
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JxH
You realize that these system are emitting HUGE amplitude acoustic ultrasonic energy at 40 kHz, and although you can't directly hear ultrasonic audio it's still not a brilliant idea to be experimenting with such acoustic levels in close proximity to your more sensitive body parts. You saw what can happen to aluminum foil, so do not be holding this array up close to your face.
The concept partially explained here (in the video) is about the Amplitude Modulation (AM) waveform, where the carrier is the 40 kHz audio in the air. What wasn't mentioned is that the detector in this system is created by non-linearities in your ears; non-linearities caused by the massive acoustic amplitude of the 40 kHz carrier. Those physical non-linearities detect the input waveform that was Amplitude Modulated onto the 40 kHz audio carrier wave.
Your ears are being driven into a non-linear region. What I SAID THAT YOUR EARS ARE BEING DRIVEN INTO A NON-LINEAR REGION! AND WHY ARE YOUR EYEBALLS BLEEDING
Be careful.
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You realize that these system are emitting HUGE amplitude acoustic ultrasonic energy at 40 kHz, and although you can't directly hear ultrasonic audio it's still not a brilliant idea to be experimenting with such acoustic levels in close proximity to your more sensitive body parts. You saw what can happen to aluminum foil, so do not be holding this array up close to your face.
The concept partially explained here (in the video) is about the Amplitude Modulation (AM) waveform, where the carrier is the 40 kHz audio in the air. What wasn't mentioned is that the detector in this system is created by non-linearities in your ears; non-linearities caused by the massive acoustic amplitude of the 40 kHz carrier. Those physical non-linearities detect the input waveform that was Amplitude Modulated onto the 40 kHz audio carrier wave.
Your ears are being driven into a non-linear region. What I SAID THAT YOUR EARS ARE BEING DRIVEN INTO A NON-LINEAR REGION! AND WHY ARE YOUR EYEBALLS BLEEDING
Be careful.
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noelandrew3600
if you instead mounted the array of transducers into a parabolic dish shape you would have been able to maximise the linier directional beam to really make them hyper directional. having them set up like both the buy and your home made version, doesn't so much come out as a cone, but more like 50 little intersecting cones leading to the scatter audio and likely some of the distortion.
making a mk2 version of this would take it to the next level, and maybe work on the amplification a bit to make it variable, even add a ir remote.
All up though this is a pretty awesome project, and yet another rabbit hole for me to fall down. mind is already working about using the ultrasonic levitator 3d prints that are online and repurpose them as speakers, make it so you and your wife can sit next to each other and listen to different music without headphones.
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if you instead mounted the array of transducers into a parabolic dish shape you would have been able to maximise the linier directional beam to really make them hyper directional. having them set up like both the buy and your home made version, doesn't so much come out as a cone, but more like 50 little intersecting cones leading to the scatter audio and likely some of the distortion.
making a mk2 version of this would take it to the next level, and maybe work on the amplification a bit to make it variable, even add a ir remote.
All up though this is a pretty awesome project, and yet another rabbit hole for me to fall down. mind is already working about using the ultrasonic levitator 3d prints that are online and repurpose them as speakers, make it so you and your wife can sit next to each other and listen to different music without headphones.
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DUKE_of_RAMBLE
Theoretically, if you used a circular arrangement like the Buy version, and also wired it (designed the PCB) so that every leg of the ultrasonic module was oriented pointing towards the center, you could then slightly raise the outside pin! _(ideally by using a shim)_
By doing so, you'd create a crude parabola and now you're speaker would have a true focal point.
Why do this
Well, if you set it up so that the focal point is say, 15m away, then at a distance of _30m_ it would be basically as tight a break as it is when exiting the speaker! Only further away would it begin to be a cone shape like it currently is. Since this is tuneable based solely on how much you raise the outter pin, you now have the ability to increase its pinpoint range since it would be focused better.
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Theoretically, if you used a circular arrangement like the Buy version, and also wired it (designed the PCB) so that every leg of the ultrasonic module was oriented pointing towards the center, you could then slightly raise the outside pin! _(ideally by using a shim)_
By doing so, you'd create a crude parabola and now you're speaker would have a true focal point.
Why do this
Well, if you set it up so that the focal point is say, 15m away, then at a distance of _30m_ it would be basically as tight a break as it is when exiting the speaker! Only further away would it begin to be a cone shape like it currently is. Since this is tuneable based solely on how much you raise the outter pin, you now have the ability to increase its pinpoint range since it would be focused better.
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Enjoymentboy
I can see something like this being great to help with that one noisy alcoholic neighbour we have to understand just how noisy they are. A nice directional microphone aimed at their house providing the input and this speaker aimed right back at their house (usually the living room area) to provide the output. When they go on a binge and start their yapping everything they yell gets easily picked up by the mic and sent directly back to the specific location they are in, likely at a window. As they go one and on they'll hear their own nonsense being sent back as if they are yelling at themselves like a drunken echo. Even if this doesn't get them to stop it would be nice for the them to have a taste of their own medicine.
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I can see something like this being great to help with that one noisy alcoholic neighbour we have to understand just how noisy they are. A nice directional microphone aimed at their house providing the input and this speaker aimed right back at their house (usually the living room area) to provide the output. When they go on a binge and start their yapping everything they yell gets easily picked up by the mic and sent directly back to the specific location they are in, likely at a window. As they go one and on they'll hear their own nonsense being sent back as if they are yelling at themselves like a drunken echo. Even if this doesn't get them to stop it would be nice for the them to have a taste of their own medicine.
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GrantFalkenburg
Pulse-width modulating a 40kHz square wave is not equivalent to amplitude modulating a sine wave. This is best understood by the Fourier transform of a pulse wave, as calculated in the Pulse Wave wikipedia article. The result of the PWM is that the 40kHz frequency component has amplitude proportional to sin(piD, which is a very non-linear transfer function (D=duty cycle. It is most linear near the extremes D=0 and D=1; using a small amplitude modulation near these extremes would linearize the signal at the cost of introducing a DC component to the output (assuming the speakers are driven with an H-bridge. I’m surprised this method yielded output quality similar to the off-the-shelf version presented in the video.
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Pulse-width modulating a 40kHz square wave is not equivalent to amplitude modulating a sine wave. This is best understood by the Fourier transform of a pulse wave, as calculated in the Pulse Wave wikipedia article. The result of the PWM is that the 40kHz frequency component has amplitude proportional to sin(piD, which is a very non-linear transfer function (D=duty cycle. It is most linear near the extremes D=0 and D=1; using a small amplitude modulation near these extremes would linearize the signal at the cost of introducing a DC component to the output (assuming the speakers are driven with an H-bridge. I’m surprised this method yielded output quality similar to the off-the-shelf version presented in the video.
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MichalKobuszewski
I think the transducers have a fairly high Q factor meaning that they will vibrate for a while after the drive signal is gone. This makes it a challenge for the speaker to accurately reproduce higher frequencies. I know some transducers used in non-destructive testing are purposefully damped with some acoustic material to quench the vibrations faster. This exponential decay can certainly be modeled (as an observer algorithm) and a kind of feedback loop can be incorporated in the software to drive the PWM modulator. I believe driving the transducers in opposite phase can be used to stop the existing oscillations faster. Suddenly we are on the verge of an academic paper: )
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I think the transducers have a fairly high Q factor meaning that they will vibrate for a while after the drive signal is gone. This makes it a challenge for the speaker to accurately reproduce higher frequencies. I know some transducers used in non-destructive testing are purposefully damped with some acoustic material to quench the vibrations faster. This exponential decay can certainly be modeled (as an observer algorithm) and a kind of feedback loop can be incorporated in the software to drive the PWM modulator. I believe driving the transducers in opposite phase can be used to stop the existing oscillations faster. Suddenly we are on the verge of an academic paper: )
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greatscott
I see this and the first project idea that comes to mind is building a phased array speaker so that you can aim the sound in different locations using the speaker. What's the application Perfect surround sound in a living room for every listener since you could have cameras do facial recognition to determine head positions, then parse off parts of the array of each speaker with the volumes adjusted for each listener's head position. Would need to get the quality of the audio up, but that should be possible by using the right electronics and higher quality components. Proving that it can be made as an array for a reasonable price is the first step.
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I see this and the first project idea that comes to mind is building a phased array speaker so that you can aim the sound in different locations using the speaker. What's the application Perfect surround sound in a living room for every listener since you could have cameras do facial recognition to determine head positions, then parse off parts of the array of each speaker with the volumes adjusted for each listener's head position. Would need to get the quality of the audio up, but that should be possible by using the right electronics and higher quality components. Proving that it can be made as an array for a reasonable price is the first step.
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MandrakeDCR
A question about this then. for us condo / apartment dwellers. would this be a solution for us to actually enjoy desktop audio again, and not have to use headphones all the time Like just how directional is it, once the beam passes you and intersects with a wall for instance Does the focused beam cause it to resonate with the wall any more than a standard speaker would
I love music and even composing, but living in this darn condo, the up/downstairs insulation is not very good, so I feel bad cranking anything up at all.
Do these dound pretty good for listening to tunes Or is it just more of a sound generator Thank you!
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A question about this then. for us condo / apartment dwellers. would this be a solution for us to actually enjoy desktop audio again, and not have to use headphones all the time Like just how directional is it, once the beam passes you and intersects with a wall for instance Does the focused beam cause it to resonate with the wall any more than a standard speaker would
I love music and even composing, but living in this darn condo, the up/downstairs insulation is not very good, so I feel bad cranking anything up at all.
Do these dound pretty good for listening to tunes Or is it just more of a sound generator Thank you!
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geensignaal
Good setup for playing around. How high is the sound pressure in the ultrasonic range at the ear
Be careful if you expose yourself to ultrasound for a longer time. Work safety is currently revising the sound pressure limits. The last values came from studies carried out in the 60s and 70s. At least one of them has already been withdrawn as faulty. A maximum of 70dB at 20kHz is recommended and the INIRC/IRPA recommends a limit of 100 dB between 25kHz and 100kHz. I know nothing about children. However, I suspect that the limits are generally lower.
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Good setup for playing around. How high is the sound pressure in the ultrasonic range at the ear
Be careful if you expose yourself to ultrasound for a longer time. Work safety is currently revising the sound pressure limits. The last values came from studies carried out in the 60s and 70s. At least one of them has already been withdrawn as faulty. A maximum of 70dB at 20kHz is recommended and the INIRC/IRPA recommends a limit of 100 dB between 25kHz and 100kHz. I know nothing about children. However, I suspect that the limits are generally lower.
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ldlm91
I've actually designed one of these for a client for use in an industrial application but used a DSP and a fairly high power D-class amplifier. My approach was also AM modulation and that the upper or lower sideband of the spectrum gets demodulated, filtering the rest. This made it as good as it gets allowing to have a decent sound quality at good efficiency. The main limitation is the narrow operational bandwidth of the ultrasonic transducers, some 38-44 KHz, which therefore limit the audible bandwidth of the demodulated sideband to those 6-8KHz max.
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I've actually designed one of these for a client for use in an industrial application but used a DSP and a fairly high power D-class amplifier. My approach was also AM modulation and that the upper or lower sideband of the spectrum gets demodulated, filtering the rest. This made it as good as it gets allowing to have a decent sound quality at good efficiency. The main limitation is the narrow operational bandwidth of the ultrasonic transducers, some 38-44 KHz, which therefore limit the audible bandwidth of the demodulated sideband to those 6-8KHz max.
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conorstewart2214
These only work straight out the front but work very similarly to phased arrays except the phase of all transmitters is the same hence the direction is straight out the front. If you individually controlled the phase of each transmitter it could be a proper phased array letting you change which direction the beam points or potentially let it point in multiple directions. That could be used with some kind of detection and tracking system to change the speaker direction so that it always points at your head when you are moving about.
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These only work straight out the front but work very similarly to phased arrays except the phase of all transmitters is the same hence the direction is straight out the front. If you individually controlled the phase of each transmitter it could be a proper phased array letting you change which direction the beam points or potentially let it point in multiple directions. That could be used with some kind of detection and tracking system to change the speaker direction so that it always points at your head when you are moving about.
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VeniceInventors
I'm still trying to wrap my head around the notion that a 40KHz ultrasound can carry lower frequency sounds that we can hear without demodulation. With AM radio it's easy to understand how a second oscillator can be used to cancel the carrier frequency, leaving us with the audio signal, but even after looking at the oscilloscope and 3Hz amplitude, I can't quite picture the air moving back and forth at lower frequencies. If I modulate the amplitude of a blue LED, won't it only flicker Or will it start looking multicolored
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I'm still trying to wrap my head around the notion that a 40KHz ultrasound can carry lower frequency sounds that we can hear without demodulation. With AM radio it's easy to understand how a second oscillator can be used to cancel the carrier frequency, leaving us with the audio signal, but even after looking at the oscilloscope and 3Hz amplitude, I can't quite picture the air moving back and forth at lower frequencies. If I modulate the amplitude of a blue LED, won't it only flicker Or will it start looking multicolored
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Graham_Langley
A thought: Did you check the polarity/phase of the ultrasonic transducers
As the polarity of the piezo ceramic element in the transducer is irrelevant in its intended application it's most likely random, which would mean the array wasn't working as intended.
FWIW many years back I made a phase/polarity checker to sort the piezo sounder elements for an alarm sounder that used two of them. The drop in sound level produced was quite obvious when two sounders of opposite phase/polarity were fitted.
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A thought: Did you check the polarity/phase of the ultrasonic transducers
As the polarity of the piezo ceramic element in the transducer is irrelevant in its intended application it's most likely random, which would mean the array wasn't working as intended.
FWIW many years back I made a phase/polarity checker to sort the piezo sounder elements for an alarm sounder that used two of them. The drop in sound level produced was quite obvious when two sounders of opposite phase/polarity were fitted.
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maxyoshida9165
This is a bit confusing honestly. at 9: 16 you are showing usage of H bridge, but then the schematic and connection 10: 27 shows you are using only 3 pins (PWM, 5V and GND. So why an H bridge A single Mosfet could have done this, right
Also, I looked at the arduino code, all it does it just configure the AD9833. Wouldnt it be better if this is done using a smaller MCU like PIC10 or even ATtiny85 But I get this part, it is probably because you have nano around and did not want to get another MCU
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This is a bit confusing honestly. at 9: 16 you are showing usage of H bridge, but then the schematic and connection 10: 27 shows you are using only 3 pins (PWM, 5V and GND. So why an H bridge A single Mosfet could have done this, right
Also, I looked at the arduino code, all it does it just configure the AD9833. Wouldnt it be better if this is done using a smaller MCU like PIC10 or even ATtiny85 But I get this part, it is probably because you have nano around and did not want to get another MCU
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ANANTHASANKAR_UA
Looking toward the future, it’s likely that technology will continue to evolve in a manner similar to beamforming in antenna systems, allowing for more precise and dynamic control over the direction of sound as we move! it will open up a range of possibilities in various fields, particularly in environments where movement or dynamic interaction is a major concern. Imagine sound that not only stays focused in one direction but adjusts in real-time as you or the listener move through space.
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Looking toward the future, it’s likely that technology will continue to evolve in a manner similar to beamforming in antenna systems, allowing for more precise and dynamic control over the direction of sound as we move! it will open up a range of possibilities in various fields, particularly in environments where movement or dynamic interaction is a major concern. Imagine sound that not only stays focused in one direction but adjusts in real-time as you or the listener move through space.
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tarheels100
It would have been interesting to discuss why ultrasound is used here instead of audible frequencies since most people may not be aware. The wavelength of ultrasound is much shorter than audible sound, so it has a smaller diffraction limit (analogous to short wavelength light in a microscope) and thus can be collimated in a much smaller beam size. To achieve the same collimation for audible sound would require a much larger array of speakers, which would create a much larger beam.
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It would have been interesting to discuss why ultrasound is used here instead of audible frequencies since most people may not be aware. The wavelength of ultrasound is much shorter than audible sound, so it has a smaller diffraction limit (analogous to short wavelength light in a microscope) and thus can be collimated in a much smaller beam size. To achieve the same collimation for audible sound would require a much larger array of speakers, which would create a much larger beam.
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Scott_C
Okay I have to ask. Can you please run an experiment for me/us the viewers with that ultrasonic board you made Use the board to make a 3D visualization matrix. Start with levitating tiny styrofoam balls. Then you should be able to use multiple balls and frequencies to make a visual object. If that get boring use a laser pointer to color the balls to make a color display, with Red, Green, Blue laser pointers you should be able to make a full gamut color display.
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Okay I have to ask. Can you please run an experiment for me/us the viewers with that ultrasonic board you made Use the board to make a 3D visualization matrix. Start with levitating tiny styrofoam balls. Then you should be able to use multiple balls and frequencies to make a visual object. If that get boring use a laser pointer to color the balls to make a color display, with Red, Green, Blue laser pointers you should be able to make a full gamut color display.
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KurtBarcelona
Great video! Finally someone had the money, time and effort in sharing a point across his audience.
Maybe just maybe you could make a big HC-04 ultrasonic distance sensor with this. Please oh please!
One array would be the transmitting side and another array would be the receiving. This would be great for open areas/sites to roughly check distance. Or perhaps a mini audio radar for drone applications. Maybe we can work on something similar to that.
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Great video! Finally someone had the money, time and effort in sharing a point across his audience.
Maybe just maybe you could make a big HC-04 ultrasonic distance sensor with this. Please oh please!
One array would be the transmitting side and another array would be the receiving. This would be great for open areas/sites to roughly check distance. Or perhaps a mini audio radar for drone applications. Maybe we can work on something similar to that.
reply
AcediaDE
I wonder how well this setup reproduces high frequencies. It might be interesting to arrange these components along an arc, perhaps using a wooden frame combined with a flexible PCB, to achieve a more dispersed sound projection, rather than focusing solely on the area directly in front. This could complement a conventional speaker system quite effectively, I think (if the high frequency performance is any worthwhile.
Gutes Video; )
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I wonder how well this setup reproduces high frequencies. It might be interesting to arrange these components along an arc, perhaps using a wooden frame combined with a flexible PCB, to achieve a more dispersed sound projection, rather than focusing solely on the area directly in front. This could complement a conventional speaker system quite effectively, I think (if the high frequency performance is any worthwhile.
Gutes Video; )
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